RE: Atheists, what are the most convincing theist arguments you heard of?
March 13, 2017 at 3:24 pm
(This post was last modified: March 13, 2017 at 3:29 pm by Neo-Scholastic.
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(March 13, 2017 at 2:11 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote:To me the difference between everyday assumptions and belief in God is a matter of degree not kind. In many ways, I have more confidence in God’s presence than many of my ordinary opinions. I can only assure you of my sincerity on this point.(March 13, 2017 at 12:57 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: …I take most things as they appear to be until shown otherwise, have good reason to suppose otherwise, or unless they affect my life enough to make me question my instincts, everyday experience, and the general consensus of history and human experience.
First off, we're talking about the existence of God here, not some ordinary proposition of everyday living. You're conflating the two, and the reason for the conflation seems abundantly apparent. You want to give the God hypothesis a pass. You're being purposely obtuse and I don't buy the act.
(March 13, 2017 at 2:11 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: You aren't some naive subject upon his first experience with the numinous. You know the objections, you choose to discard them on the basis of other arguments. That's being disingenuous. The reason you have given for not being skeptical is not the real reason you choose to ignore skepticism. I don't really care what the real reason is, but this "I take most things as they appear" is just a convenient line of bullshit.
You are correct to some extent. I am not naive about epiphanies. They are rare and come unexpectedly. I have had only two that moved me in a profound way, one of which is completely inexpressible in words. I can somewhat understand someone who has not been so moved attributing them to some psychological aberration. I know what I felt confirmed so much of what mystics and visionaries throughout recorded history have tried to convey.
You are right that I know the objections. You would be wrong to think I discarded them lightly. In fact, I pursued them rigorously. They are dead ends. For starters, you end up either discarding belief in a rational order and/or the efficacy of reason. If anything, I choose to believe many skeptics either have not pursued skepticism to its logical conclusion or won’t admit to its nihilism or embrace the absurdity. As for me, I embraced the absurdity, for a time, but I eventually decided that was, well,…absurd.
(March 13, 2017 at 12:59 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: During your reflections have you ever felt the presence of Love coming from outside yourself?
(March 13, 2017 at 2:11 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: I don't know what that means, but it sounds distinctly unhealthy.
If something makes me happy, more generous, forgiving, and patient with those around me, then it is an illness I gladly accept.