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The Trinity and Mary
#10
RE: The Trinity and Mary
(May 17, 2017 at 5:56 am)Fake Messiah Wrote: What do you mean "how do I know"? The elements were already there and you see Justin Martyr saying it. And when it comes to Jesus moral teaching we already had discussion in the topic "Love thy neighbor" on the 5th page that all the so called sentiments attributed to Jesus are were familiar in the Jewish schools, and to all the Pharisees, long before the time of Christ, as they were familiar in all the civilizations of the that time - Egyptian, Babylonian, and Persian, Greek and Hindu.

So your saying that because his morals and sentiments were reflected by earlier cultures, that proves that the gospels were made up?  How does that demonstrate that the gospels were made up?  Because Jesus believed that we should treat our neighbor well and the Greeks already believed that, then he wasn't for real?


Quote:Also even many theologians now admit that it is not likely that we have the actual words of Christ at all. One example in Matthew 11:28-30: “Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”  We may say with confidence that Christ never spoke those words.

Some theologians say he didn't, some say he did.  There is no way at all to historically determine whether he did or didn't.  Either we believe the writers or we don't.

Quote:The doctrinal implication of divinity is late: the words are inconsistent with his constant insistence that his burden is heavy and grievous (to sell all one's property, to separate from one's family, to take up one's cross, etc.); and, most decisive of all, the words are simply borrowed, with little alteration, from Ecclesiasticus (51, 23-27). It is, therefore, extremely difficult to say anywhere that we have the actual words of Christ and it is quite certain that many of the passages we cannot attribute to him are as fine and impressive as the doubtful passages.

The message of the new testament is that we can't do it by ourselves, but must rely on Christ for our salvation.  We go through life with difficult burdens, but we find rest when we give those burdens to God.  He is the one who gets us through.  He lightens our burdens.  As for him speaking of his divinity, I think this is pretty explicit:

John 10:30-38English Standard Version (ESV)
30 "I and the Father are one.”

Quote:I didn't took them. When it comes to Roman Capitoline Triad the Romans took them.

You referenced cultures that had multiple gods, more than three, but grouped some into triads and decided that the writers of the new testament copied them to form the trinity.  What about all the other gods?  I guess the christians didn't want to copy those parts.  Here's a quote from the very first book of the bible written long before the existence of the Roman civilization:

Genesis 1:26English Standard Version (ESV)
Then God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness."

Here's one from the book of Isiah, also written long before the Romans:

Isaiah 9:6English Standard Version (ESV)
6 For to us a child is born,
   to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
   and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor
 (Holy Spirit), Mighty God,
   Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace (Jesus).

What you're doing is searching for similarities among christianity and other religions, and if there is some some similarity that was manifested earlier in another, then you're saying that christianity copied it.  There are countless similarities in our modern culture to ancient civilizations.  Does this mean that we copied them or that we just share some common ideas?
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Messages In This Thread
The Trinity and Mary - by vorlon13 - May 16, 2017 at 1:59 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 16, 2017 at 4:29 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 16, 2017 at 2:43 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 17, 2017 at 5:56 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 17, 2017 at 1:09 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 18, 2017 at 4:24 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 18, 2017 at 2:33 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Cyberman - May 18, 2017 at 2:53 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 19, 2017 at 2:18 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 19, 2017 at 6:11 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Drich - May 18, 2017 at 8:38 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Minimalist - May 16, 2017 at 11:33 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by John V - May 16, 2017 at 2:53 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by CapnAwesome - May 16, 2017 at 3:02 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by vorlon13 - May 16, 2017 at 9:07 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Cyberman - May 16, 2017 at 9:10 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Cyberman - May 18, 2017 at 9:13 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Harry Nevis - May 18, 2017 at 10:07 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Minimalist - May 18, 2017 at 11:25 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 18, 2017 at 4:53 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 19, 2017 at 4:33 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 20, 2017 at 4:06 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by John V - May 24, 2017 at 4:13 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 25, 2017 at 3:50 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by John V - May 25, 2017 at 12:17 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 26, 2017 at 4:44 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Harry Nevis - May 25, 2017 at 8:01 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 25, 2017 at 12:05 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Harry Nevis - May 23, 2017 at 8:38 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 24, 2017 at 12:15 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Harry Nevis - May 24, 2017 at 12:28 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 24, 2017 at 6:47 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Fake Messiah - May 30, 2017 at 4:08 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 30, 2017 at 12:28 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Cyberman - May 19, 2017 at 4:53 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 19, 2017 at 5:42 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Silver - May 19, 2017 at 5:44 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 19, 2017 at 6:47 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Silver - May 19, 2017 at 6:50 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Cyberman - May 19, 2017 at 5:48 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 20, 2017 at 3:37 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by The Grand Nudger - May 24, 2017 at 12:24 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by vorlon13 - May 24, 2017 at 7:02 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Minimalist - May 24, 2017 at 7:07 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by The Grand Nudger - May 25, 2017 at 12:38 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 25, 2017 at 2:02 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by The Grand Nudger - May 25, 2017 at 11:31 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Lek - May 26, 2017 at 10:32 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Harry Nevis - May 26, 2017 at 11:01 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by vorlon13 - May 25, 2017 at 11:46 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by The Grand Nudger - May 25, 2017 at 11:47 pm
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by The Grand Nudger - May 26, 2017 at 11:48 am
RE: The Trinity and Mary - by Minimalist - May 26, 2017 at 11:57 am

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