(June 23, 2017 at 2:53 am)nosferatu323 Wrote:I'm afraid that no amount of you saying that you don't think there was an equivocation will change the fact that it's an equivocation.Quote:If I told you that a fork was a spoon...you wouldn't say "Yeah, legit, cuz I mean words are vague and stuff"..now would you? If a diabetic asked for his insulin, it would be important that you didn't grab a syringe full of coca-cola...huh?I think I understand your objection. I don't think there is any equivocation.
Quote:Please consider this analogy:3- We find out that people think that the term means many different things, but that those things share some commonalities which justify their inclusion in the set of x. We also find, that some people, include things in the set of x that are not like the others. Things like...the universe.
1. We want to talk about the existence of X,
2. first we look into dictionaries and encyclopedias to learn what X is before we start talking about it. So we can avoid meaning different things by X and remove the possibility of equivocation.
3. We find out that X has many different meanings, so we pick them one by one (not two of them at the same time) and investigate them separately. This way it's clear what we mean by X in each investigation.
4. First we pick up Zeus we investigate it, since there is no evidence to suggest Zeus exists, we conclude that Zeus does not exist. Great! This is resolved.
5. Next one, we pick up "The creator of universe" again using the same argument we conclude that "The creator" does not exist. we do this for many times and we are happy.
6. We come across "The universe itself", no matter how much we try we can never conclude that "The universe itself" does not exist.
7. We write a report of our investigation: "We discovered that 99 definitions of X lack the evidence for their existence, but 1 of them clearly exist"
8. So we can say "I don't believe in these gods [comes the list of 99 definitions]" but since we found 1 definition of god which is existent, we cannot assert "We do not believe in any gods"
6- We can never conclude that the universe does not exist..but that;s irrelevant, since the set of x we're discussing is gods...not universes. We are concluding that gods do not exist..mostly because they don't, even if universes do.
8- We have found no definition of a god which is existent. We have found an equivocation of god with an existent universe.
Quote:I Hope this clarifies that there is no equivocation in the argument.
It doesn't, because nothing can. It was and remains an explicit equivocation. If you ask me if I believe in gods, but by gods you really mean "the universe"..and I say no...and then you ask me why I don't believe in the universe....but by the universe you really mean "gods", there's just no way to rescue it. It doesn't matter whether you or anyone else believes that the universe is a god, because it's still an equivocation.
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