RE: A Question From Atheists
June 23, 2017 at 5:56 pm
(This post was last modified: June 23, 2017 at 5:59 pm by bennyboy.)
(June 23, 2017 at 3:52 pm)nosferatu323 Wrote:(June 23, 2017 at 3:38 pm)Cyberman Wrote: If he wants to define the god we don't believe in as the Universe, I'm okay with that. My response would be to agree that it does indeed exist; but I would dismiss the claim that it is a god. That's the part for which I would need to see some evidence - but since he's shooting his own argument through the head by insisting he doesn't need to show evidence, that really is the end of the conversation.
A common misunderstanding in a theist/atheists conversation is that the theist ones always intend to "convert" the atheist ones or vice-versa. This was never my intention. I'm not intending to prove to you that god exists or your should believe in god. I wanted to demonstrate that the proposition:
"I don't believe in any gods"
Is nonsensical from a logical perspective. Since when we investigate the word "god" we come across the cases where this proposition leads to clear fallacies.
I made the mistake of talking about my personal beliefs in several occasions which might have been mis-leading for some that I'm trying to justify my own belief, which is not the case. I'm sorry about that.
Quote:But your argument isn't "Pantheists believe that the universe is god." Everyone already accepts that Pantheists believe this. You're asserting that the universe is in fact god - which is something that you need to justify.No I'm not intending to prove that. I'm sorry if my lack of focus on the main topic made you to believe that I'm intending to prove that. I actually think it's logically absurd to try to "prove" such a belief.
Not really. "I don't believe in any gods" doesn't mean "I disbelieve all possible definitions of god." It means somebody doesn't have any image or definition of "god" which they think represents fact.
If you say God is John Lennon, then I'd say I believe in God, but it's a pretty poor definition.
Saying "God is the Universe" is also a poor definition. You'd have to show that the Universe has at least some of the characteristics normally associated with God-- like consciousness, intent, etc. Otherwise, there's very little importance to the God idea, since we are perfectly happy living in, and studying scientifically, the Universe.
