(August 16, 2017 at 2:09 pm)Crossless2.0 Wrote:To you he may have been unprovoked untill Trump started with His big man big stick stich.(August 16, 2017 at 1:32 pm)Drich Wrote:
Again.. provide one instance where we/obama or bush told Un to back down and He did.
Dude never backed down because he thought china always would have his back.
"Trump's rhetoric" has unnerved the Chinese enough to tell either side if the start something China will not back them. Trump bluff/rhetoric says he does not care, which has china doubble down on sanctions to north korea and start moving from them. It is this pressure that has UN backing down, not because he was going to anyway.
Think about it.. why would UN uset the only country willing to deal with Him if he was always planning to back down?
When it came to his development of ICBMs and nuclear weapons, you're right -- he never backed down. But that's not the context of my remark.
With respect to Kim's bluster about attacking Guam, do you really think he meant to do that (knowing the consequences) and only backed down because of Trump's public bellicosity? Seriously?!?
But the North Koreans have been provke by the US since the cease fire in the 50s.
Quote:Provide one instance when the U.S. has removed the nuclear option from the table in the event of a nuclear attack or a conventional-weapons attack via ICBMs from North Korea or anyone else.When clinton signed the "new era" agreement where the US paid outbillions to North Korea in an effort to not be a dick country when IL was in charge.
https://video.search.yahoo.com/yhs/searc...ction=view
This is almost identical to what Obama did for Iran.
Quote:Kim got what he thinks he needs to prevent attack/invasion from his enemies and secure his regime: an overwhelming deterrent.Ah, no.. He had that overwhelming deterrent since 1953 when China poured their guys into the korean conflict to bring us back to the stalemate on the 38th paralell. That deterrent has been in place since then which is why every president except trump has treated N.korea with kid gloves. Untill trump. Trump's "rhetoric" unseated the chinese and for the first time in 60+ years put the north Korean sheild/China's army at risk.
Now let me ask you this... If Jong UN wasn't intent on blowing up guam then why endanger his relationship with China?? Look at what has been taken from North korea.. The only country that will trade with them has cut off their 4 largest exports (at considerable cost to China) And we now know that their is a limit on How much BS from North korea they are willing to protect... That is a monstrous loss to the idea of invurnablity north korea had.
Quote:That is what has motivated N. Korea's nuclear program from the start.To a degree. in reality what they wanted was to hold the world hostage and open trade by force. the Kim's wanted to act with impunity and have their nukes to keep them from anything any other country may want to do to them. In essence they see themselves as a world super power, but the United states will not allow them to take the stage. So the nukes will allow them to do this by force.
Quote: Whether Trump or another occupied the White House, do you really think Kim was going to go to the trouble of developing this capability, only to use it with the knowledge that he would destroy his regime in the process?China would not have allowed any response by us which is why Obama acted like a neutered dog around the n.koreans. He sold his soul to china with all the money he had to borrow from them. Trump has made it clear he will collapse the global economy before he lets any harm come to America. Which is why China is backed off the support of N.Korea and why the trade sanctions we wanted since China to put into place since Regan is finally happening with Trump... Trump knows how to manipulate a lender (when He is in the spot of being too big to fail like the US is with China) into getting what He needs from them. That is the card that obama did not know how to play and what makes China Sanction N.Korea like it never has before.
So again if this was Kim Un's plan... I simply ask why/How does N/K benfit from all that has happened?