Arguments Against Creator God

[GrandizerII]

Which I summarize as follows, - "I don't believe in God because there are a few essential factors which don't make any logical sense."

I wouldn't word it like that, as the wording you use here doesn't clearly distinguish between logic and intuition. And it's not "just a few". There are all sorts of logical problems with a God that is beyond time and space. I only mentioned a very few. Trivializing much?

Fair enough, and you also admitted that we as humans are limited in our understanding. I think we have fallen a long way from our original state of intelligence.

To be accurate, I said our intuition cannot be completely trusted when it comes to the matter of God and existence in general. As for your second sentence, bullshit.

I assume that your religion failed to deliver the details you were entitled to know. None the less, you may persist in finding the answers for yourself in the Bible, you can advance above common religion, science and thinking.

What the hell are you talking about here?

The Impossibility of "Nothingness"

God isn't nothing, so there is no reason to conclude that something came from nothing.

The Creator God is separate from everything else in existence, according to traditional Christianity. If you don't believe in the typical/mainstream Creator God, then this thread wasn't made for you.

The Impossibility of "Something from Nothing"

Things were created by the power or the substance of the Word of God, which is something which goes out from God's mouth and returns to him in whatever form he has thought.

This doesn't debunk the argument. You are talking about a different type of causation here, when my argument is about the material cause that just happens to be non-existent in this "thing" that we call "nothing". Or are you arguing that the material cause just happens to be in God himself? If so, then this argument doesn't debunk your kind of God.

The Word isn't sound in the air, it is the breath, the light and the life of God. It has infinite properties, and it contains wisdom or intelligence, all the possibilities of power and organisation, and the power of life itself, which is able to create a horrendously massive creation, with an infinite number of activities and relations etc.

You are just making things more complicated than they need to be. Whether God or God's Word did the creation is irrelevant. God's Word is still God. And so, you still haven't solved the problem described in my argument.

Basically the Word is as great as God in all of its power. There are many features of the Word which we should discuss in detail, because they give the correct understanding of the nature of matter and how things not only exist, but how they were made.

Ok? Why not list some of them then? Explain how they give a correct understanding of the nature of matter and such.

Religions in general do not get into the nitty gritty of the Bible, they just pretend to have its authority and then trample on its requirements.

Who cares what you think about religions and the Bible? I only want you to address the arguments. Give me valid logic, not theological nonsense.

The Impossibility of Timeless Creation

The concept of time is out of our general capability to reason, and from what I have read in sceintific treatises, our theories are like trying to fly by pulling up on the shoe laces.

Anything to dismiss what modern science has to say just to cling to your God belief, right?

But the Bible gives many clues about time, which are fascinating, without going into detail - it's a big library.

This thread is not about the damned Bible, which is a collection of ancient books written by men who didn't know as much as we do now about the world and everything in it.

However, there are about ten major features about time, (just like there are ten basic laws of God which govern all of creation - both spiritually and physically) one of tose features is that it can be experienced differently. That goes without saying, and it is a topic which has been discussed in some scientific disciplines.

Irrelevant, as the argument is about the impossibility of time being created, not about what time is.

The Bible says that "One day (with the Lord, not with men) is as a thousand years..." and visa versa.

See above.

The ability to have the full options in the experiences of time, depends on the level of intelligence and physical power/energy.

What?

In the case of God, the time rates and experiences of the universe are deliberate equations, of which there are an endless variety, but there are specific and general principles, which govern all of the creation, so that one day and hour equals literal time, no matter where you go. There is a universal consistency.

Ok, and? How does this address the argument I provided?

BTW, all creations, have a simple side and a complex side. For instance the simple cell, isn't simple at all, but is as complex as all of the knowledge in the world at this time.

And?

We already accept the simple side of time, and that's generally what is discussed in science.

And?

But as far as Divinity is concerned time is not a constraint, but one (intergrating) tool of an endless number of tools, that have been incorporated.

Do you really believe you're making any sense at all? I'm having a hard time following your train of thought. What are you talking about? And what does this have to do with the arguments against God provided in the OP?

We are allowed to discuss the realm of God, in the persistent context of our limited capability, as you have already pointed out.

Yeah, you're allowed that. So let's please discuss the arguments instead of going off track here and there.

The Impossibility of Mindful Creation

You've bought up some interesting points here, and they are complex.

In a sense God did not deliberate the creation of the universe, it was consequential of his existence. It was spontaneous without fore-thought, but on the other hand it was always fully and completely planned. In the case of Divinity it can be both at once.

So you concede that this is a logical contradiction, but that since this is God, this is allowed, right? Can God logically cease to become God as well?

Take for instance, the words of Jesus about himself, he says "I am the first and the last, the beginning and the ending, the alpha and the omega...etc"

You know what? You're just wasting my time with this theological nonsense. If you're not going to make an attempt to use logic properly, forget it. Find someone else to discuss theology with. I'm not interested.

He did not say "I make beginnings and endings" although that is true, but he is both the beginning and ending simultaneously. Go figure that one out.

It's all very interesting, and we will inevitably discuss the details.

No, please don't. Thank you in advance.