RE: How to beat a presupp at their own game
March 17, 2021 at 7:58 am
(This post was last modified: March 17, 2021 at 8:00 am by The Grand Nudger.)
(March 17, 2021 at 4:10 am)Superjock Wrote: The chat server is filled with presupps and the number one objection for atheism that I hear is what grounds our atheism?
Very simple. Atheism is "grounded" when we have no personal impetus to believe in gods. That's all that the word means, so that's all that it takes.
Quote:What grounds do we have for facts and knowledge?The same grounds for facts and knowledge that anyone else has, whatever those are - for better and for worse. Adding or removing a divine friend has no effect on knowledge claims or their basis.
Quote:How can we know anything in a godless world?The same way we know things, if we know things, in a god-ed world. To say that we know something is, like atheism or theism, primarily, a claim about ourselves - not a claim about a god. In a godless or god-ed world we either know the thing, anything, or we do not. Really, though, the questioner would have to be more specific. You know your own name and what ice cream tastes like for reasons not at all similar to how you know that william lead the norman conquest.
Quote:From their view, God is the foundation of knowledge. It's self-justifying - how do they know? God revealed it through special and divine revelation and therefore they cannot be wrong. So to deny this, means that atheists are appealing to a non-personal universe (??) (I'm probably not stating this argument 100%, I"m tired and haven't slept)Well, rather than arguing this point, ask them to explain what they mean by it. How, in what way, is god the foundation of knowledge? Who's knowledge? What knowledge? The foundation of knowledge of my own name or what ice cream tastes like? You'll reach a point where..either what they have to say on the subject convinces you, or it does not..and then you have an even more specific answer for the very first question.
If you say the universe is my starting point as an atheist, they'll say what grounds the universe?
One of the primary presupps there is Darth Darkins. Anyone know how to dismantle this type of argument?
If a person has attempted and failed to convince you of a gods existence..they too are now part of the "grounding" of your atheism. Congratulate them on a job well done.
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