Angrboda and Fake Messiah: yes, i definitely agree: there is no way to know who is or isnt a Christian. but a Christian isnt expected to know. it's not a Christian's business to judge: Christ is the judge. a Christian's job is to live by hope and be offensive to no one. so if one says he's a Christian, we're supposed to live by the hope that he is if we see no reason to disbelieve him at present (1 Corinthians 13:7, Romans 14:10-13).
i agree this matter of fruits can be confusing. but i believe what solves this is the mention of another type of tree: one that is barren. i think the interpretations can vary but i believe this allows us to inspect the actions that we see and live by hope accordingly.
LinuxGal: Paul constantly warns about "running/believing in vain", so i dont believe he's saying that deeds are not important. i think it's a matter of explaining the order in which conversion occurs, believing first with good actions coming after.
about improper witnessing, i think it's well explained in the New Testament how to do so properly. but i believe doing so requires cultivated faith, humility, and spiritual experience (which the Bible emphasizes), **none of which are necessarily developed from having the Bible memorized.
GUBU: i mentioned before that i believe the bias we all have is doing what is right. loving Christ first doesnt change this but perfects it: it makes us accomplish the same good actions but perfects the intentions behind those actions. for example, father and mother: i think a lot of kids do the actions they do to try to please their parents. so if the kid loves the parents above everything and the parents are evil, the kid turns evil and cant turn away from this. Christianity teaches that the real reason we are to obey our parents is to live in accordance with what God has ordained, which is that children have parents. therefore, we are obedient to them to stay on God's side, not our parents', so should our parents be/turn evil we wont.
i agree this matter of fruits can be confusing. but i believe what solves this is the mention of another type of tree: one that is barren. i think the interpretations can vary but i believe this allows us to inspect the actions that we see and live by hope accordingly.
LinuxGal: Paul constantly warns about "running/believing in vain", so i dont believe he's saying that deeds are not important. i think it's a matter of explaining the order in which conversion occurs, believing first with good actions coming after.
about improper witnessing, i think it's well explained in the New Testament how to do so properly. but i believe doing so requires cultivated faith, humility, and spiritual experience (which the Bible emphasizes), **none of which are necessarily developed from having the Bible memorized.
GUBU: i mentioned before that i believe the bias we all have is doing what is right. loving Christ first doesnt change this but perfects it: it makes us accomplish the same good actions but perfects the intentions behind those actions. for example, father and mother: i think a lot of kids do the actions they do to try to please their parents. so if the kid loves the parents above everything and the parents are evil, the kid turns evil and cant turn away from this. Christianity teaches that the real reason we are to obey our parents is to live in accordance with what God has ordained, which is that children have parents. therefore, we are obedient to them to stay on God's side, not our parents', so should our parents be/turn evil we wont.
