RE: Ben Shapiro vs Neil deGrasse Tyson: The WAR Over Transgender Issues
January 27, 2025 at 4:54 pm
(This post was last modified: January 27, 2025 at 4:59 pm by Sheldon.)
(January 26, 2025 at 7:27 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: I do think that there is an objective difference between stepping on a toe and murder.As do I, but I think this misses the point, as the assertion that either is immoral is subjective. We can objectively measure consequences of actions of course, and this definitely informs my morality, but when asked why murder is wrong, it leads ultimately to a subjective claim.
Quote:I do think one is objectively more harmful than the other.
I agree, but again the assertion causing harm is immoral is a subjective one, thus ultimately the assertion either act is immoral seems to rest ultimately on a subjective opinion.
Quote:Is this purely my private opinion with no basis in facts of toes and murder and harm?
No, but it doesn't matter, as the assertion that causing harm is immoral is where we get to a subjective one. I already acknowledged we can make objective moral decisions - once we subjectively accept an action is immoral, or leads to immorality, in this instance causing harm.
Note this is also relative, since I would limit even my subjective assertion to unnecessary harm, we don't arrest dentists for causing pain, or surgeons for cutting you with sharp scalpels for example, and we would of course cite mitigation where harm is caused to prevent a greater harm, as I said earlier.
Quote:Is this purely the product of my cultural indoctrination with no basis in facts of toes and murder and harm?
No, but it is only immoral if we accept the assertion that causing harm is immoral, and that is as far as I can see a subjective assertion, and a relative one in as much as it does not apply universally even if we accept the assertion.
If I stepped deliberately on your toe without reason, then I would consider that wrong, though subjectively. If I stepped on your toe by accident to shove you out of the way of a speeding car you'd not seen, then I would not consider it wrong. Since the same action caused the same harm, it is clear it is not objectively true that causing harm is immoral, it merely is a subjective conclusion I drew based on the relative consequences of actions.