RE: Ben Shapiro vs Neil deGrasse Tyson: The WAR Over Transgender Issues
January 28, 2025 at 12:03 pm
(This post was last modified: January 28, 2025 at 12:26 pm by Sheldon.)
(January 28, 2025 at 11:47 am)Ferrocyanide Wrote:It seems clear enough, morality is defined as "principles concerning the distinction between right and wrong or good and bad behaviour."(January 27, 2025 at 7:15 pm)Sheldon Wrote: It's the dictionary's definition, not mine. I don't compile those, they reflect current common usage.
You assumed your conclusion in your opening premise.
Sorry if I wasn’t clear. I was talking about the dictionary definition. It doesn't have circular reasoning or begging, which is good. The problem is that it is vague.
Quote:I think the definition of the word morality makes it unclearMakes what unclear?
Quote:Sheldon:
I agree it is immoral, but this must ultimately rest on a subjective opinion, not an objective one, but please explain why you think this without ultimately resorting to a subjective opinion. I have tried and cannot, perhaps you can. I must say I am dubious.
Quote:Ferrocyanide
I already explained it but I will be happy to explain it again in the hopes that it becomes clear:
All humans have pain sensors. It is an objective fact. If you punch a person in the face, a signal is generated and it reaches the brain and the human feels pain. Are we an agreement that so far, all this is objective fact?
Pretty much all humans don’t like that. They will all want to have a rule that says “don’t punch people in the face because it causes pain” <===is this rule subjective?
Can you demonstrate objectively that causing pain is immoral? Otherwise as I said in that quote, you are ultimately resting your moral assertion on a subjective claim.
Quote:There is no guidebook, no program that tells you what you must perform specifically to stop a rape in your particular scenario. It was entirely up to your abilities and circumstances. Out of many possibilities, for some reason, you chose punch in the face.
So subjectively immoral then, not objectively immoral, as I said.
Quote:The rape part was objectively immoral.
I disagree, but if you think you can demonstrate this without resorting to a subjective moral claim please do.
Quote:It is similar to your rape case. A damage is occurring to person X.
Yes but the claim that causing damage to someone or something is immoral, is a subjective claim, it is not objectively true. just try asking why something is immoral, and see if it does not ultimately rest on a subjective claim.