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Morality
#51
RE: Morality
(April 16, 2012 at 9:35 am)genkaus Wrote: [quote='Drich' pid='273199' dateline='1334579345']Smile ...and who sets these standards? Man, or the society he lives in.. Are all societies morality the same? no they are not. Can some societies standards be judged more sinful than others? Even by the non religious?? Yes.

Quote:A man chooses what moral code he lives by. A society's moral code is chosen by what its members agree on. One society's moral code can be judged according to another society's - which would result in it being regarded as more or less sinful. For example. my moral code says that the christian morality is extremely sinful.
Indeed then by that definition and omission you assessment of morality is the same as the biblical one: Morality is man's attempt to establish a righteous standard based on the sin he or the society he lives in is willing to except Incorporated into that standard. Do you want me to break it down and show you how you have accepted the biblical defination of morality?

Quote:Wrong. Morality is not changing - there are simply different moralities.
So you believe in one's society Morality never changes?

Quote:There is morality of one society as opposed to the morality of another, irrespective of whether those societies are separated by space or time.
Smile I guess that answers my question. Now i will ask, do you think the morality of 1930's and 40's Germany is the same or different as modern day germeny?? Do you think the morality of 1950's and 60' America is the same or different than now? If no then apparently you are not, nor do you know any Jewish, gay, or black people. Because popular morality that governed those societies in those time periods mentioned, are a far cry from where they are now. Murder the 'uncrossable line' in your understanding of morality, was not only encouraged but frequently visited upon these social groups of people. to the tune of millions.

Quote:You are the one changing the definition to suit your purpose.

Here are the accepted definitions of righteousness:

- adhering to moral principles (wordnetweb.princeton.edu)
- noun
1. the quality or state of being righteous.
2. righteous conduct.
3. the quality or state of being just or rightful: They came to realize the righteousness of her position on the matter.

- righteous (Dictionary.com)
— adj
1. a. characterized by, proceeding from, or in accordance with accepted standards of morality, justice, or uprightness; virtuous: a righteous man
b. ( as collective noun ; preceded by the ): the righteous
2. morally justifiable or right, esp from one's own point of view: righteous indignation


Which definition are you using?
You are making my argument for me. either you do not understand what is being discussed here or you are simply not equip to represent your position. If you read my opening Post I identify two understandings of the word morality, one that the popular culture has embraced and the other is a biblically back understanding of the word.

Quote:If you'd actually bothered to read any of the other threads, you'd know that I live in India - not a western society. I'm debating on a forum populated by westerners, which would automatically take me out of my comfort zone and right in the middle of another culture.
Smile Debating in a forum has nothing to do with living in a foreign society and adopting their morality as your own. (As per the orginal comment made) Bottom line is your in India and shout your idea of morality to anyone with an opposing view. If you are not careful you will adopt the mentality that has the rest of the world hating the western culture.Wink

BTW just in case you want to know what I am on about, an example of you being forced to adopt a new culture as your own would be if your family was up rooted and place in a different country to live and force to adopt that culture, that way of living, while having your original trivialized and every aspect taken from you. No you get the best of both worlds as it is now. you can sit where you are comfortable and judge from your chair all that is not what you are accustomed to. way to be enlightened.

Quote:In future, please refrain from making any assumptions about me. You just make a fool of yourself. More that usual, that is.
Big Grin As I just pointed out your location has little to do with your self righteous attitude. It does not matter where you are from. i identified a behavior in what you have said, that places your work accurately in a category that I described "the reason people of the world hate those in the west."
You can pull the "you don't know me card" if you like, but your word thoughts, and deeds have been spilled out all over this thread. Your own work points to the nature of "who you are" I do not have to assume anything. You told me yourself.

(April 16, 2012 at 8:29 am)Drich Wrote: Do you have an example?

Quote:Are you allowed to eat shellfish?
Yes, shell fish, blood sausage, bacon, ham, hamburger, unshelled fish.. what else you got?

(April 16, 2012 at 8:29 am)Drich Wrote: I am not trying to upset the little world you have created for yourself. I am only speaking to those who want biblical clarity. If you wish to live in your moral world then understand I have no issue allowing you to live and die by whatever standard your wish. I am post for those who mistakenly but feel a rightful want to judge God by the morality they have made for themselves.

Quote:No, you are trying to impose your own little world onto everyone else. Forgive us if we don't sit by silently.
Big Grin Did I interrupt your thread or create my own? Because I created my own know, that it was not my intention to force anyone to address anything I had said. My comments were pointed to only those who wished to question God's actions by their current understanding of morality.

Quote:Secondly, biblical clarity? Give me a break. I don't see the word "Bible" anywhere in the OP or the title. If you'd prefaced your post by saying, "According to the Bible..." my arguments would've been completely different.
As per my introduction and every post since, My sole purpose here is to answer biblically based questions and to provide biblical clarity.
If you would have read ANY of the other posts in this thread with an open mind, this fact would quickly become apparent.

Quote:And thirdly, what relevance does telling us what the Bible means by morality and righteousness have when a) those definitions are subjective and meaningless, b) not accepted by general populace when talking about morality and c) god's actions are clearly sinful (according to the morality that is accepted by the general populace).

Because of "C" Only a fool judges another outside of his standard of living by his standard of living. My efforts are focused on those who truly seek an honest understanding. In that their "standard" of morality is not a standard at all. but a variable based on time culture and perspective.

Which brings up the bigger question: So how can anyone; let alone God, be judged by what is right today in this part of the world, when tomorrow or just a few thousand miles away all of that can change? In that situation who would be the one to correctly judge God? the guys that says it is ok kill gay people in an earth quake or the guy praying for his gay brother in said quake? That is why if you are to judge God then it has to be by an absolute standard, like the one Given in the bible.

Quote:All you are doing is forcing your stupidity on everyone. Sorry, but I'm not going to let that stand either. Countering lies and foolishness under the guise of an intellectual debate is a part of my moral code.
I honestly don't think you know what is being discussed. Perhaps if you asked a few more questions i could help provide you with a better idea of what is going on.
(April 16, 2012 at 9:48 am)tobie Wrote: There are various ( scientific ) explanations on why we humans have morals. Some say that it is a side effect of evolution. Incest, for example, is taboo because it can cause genetic defects, and so will be detrimental to the species ( as seen in any royal family ). The behaviour that generally classifies as moral evolved because they offer some evolutionary benefit.
Other theories and tests suggest that morality is due to empathy, which is also supported by mental illnesses that cause immoral behaviour, such as psychopathy, which is largely characterised by a lack of empathy.

In my opinion, it is much more likely that religion comes from morality, and a lack of understanding of it and other things, than vice versa.

Focus
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Messages In This Thread
Morality - by Drich - April 14, 2012 at 1:55 am
RE: Morality - by Phil - April 14, 2012 at 1:59 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 14, 2012 at 2:05 am
RE: Morality - by Phil - April 14, 2012 at 2:06 am
RE: Morality - by Reforged - April 14, 2012 at 6:57 pm
RE: Morality - by Cinjin - April 14, 2012 at 2:00 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 14, 2012 at 2:20 am
RE: Morality - by Cinjin - April 14, 2012 at 2:36 am
RE: Morality - by Thomas Kelly - April 14, 2012 at 7:17 am
RE: Morality - by Phil - April 14, 2012 at 7:27 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 14, 2012 at 12:10 pm
RE: Morality - by Tobie - April 14, 2012 at 12:21 pm
RE: Morality - by Tobie - April 14, 2012 at 7:43 am
RE: Morality - by Scabby Joe - April 18, 2012 at 2:29 pm
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 18, 2012 at 6:10 pm
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 18, 2012 at 6:43 pm
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 14, 2012 at 7:37 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 14, 2012 at 12:23 pm
RE: Morality - by Cinjin - April 14, 2012 at 12:46 pm
RE: Morality - by Thomas Kelly - April 14, 2012 at 1:22 pm
RE: Morality - by Tobie - April 14, 2012 at 1:37 pm
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 14, 2012 at 7:57 am
RE: Morality - by NoMoreFaith - April 14, 2012 at 8:08 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 14, 2012 at 1:38 pm
RE: Morality - by NoMoreFaith - April 14, 2012 at 3:36 pm
RE: Morality - by Cinjin - April 14, 2012 at 4:02 pm
RE: Morality - by Zen Badger - April 14, 2012 at 8:31 am
RE: Morality - by Faith No More - April 14, 2012 at 8:45 am
RE: Morality - by Paul the Human - April 14, 2012 at 1:34 pm
RE: Morality - by Neo-Scholastic - April 14, 2012 at 3:24 pm
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 14, 2012 at 9:53 pm
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 14, 2012 at 3:59 pm
RE: Morality - by Neo-Scholastic - April 14, 2012 at 6:51 pm
RE: Morality - by Neo-Scholastic - April 14, 2012 at 7:13 pm
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 16, 2012 at 3:36 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 16, 2012 at 8:29 am
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 16, 2012 at 9:35 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 16, 2012 at 3:56 pm
RE: Morality - by Reforged - April 16, 2012 at 4:23 pm
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 16, 2012 at 10:45 pm
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 16, 2012 at 5:21 pm
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 17, 2012 at 12:31 am
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 17, 2012 at 5:47 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 17, 2012 at 11:15 am
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 17, 2012 at 12:49 pm
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 17, 2012 at 4:55 pm
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 17, 2012 at 5:58 pm
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 18, 2012 at 12:43 am
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 18, 2012 at 12:53 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 18, 2012 at 12:59 am
RE: Morality - by genkaus - April 18, 2012 at 1:41 am
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 18, 2012 at 4:31 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 18, 2012 at 11:44 am
RE: Morality - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2012 at 3:49 am
RE: Morality - by Kratos - April 16, 2012 at 4:15 am
RE: Morality - by Zen Badger - April 16, 2012 at 5:05 am
RE: Morality - by Kratos - April 16, 2012 at 5:29 am
RE: Morality - by frankiej - April 16, 2012 at 7:08 am
RE: Morality - by Kratos - April 16, 2012 at 8:21 pm
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 16, 2012 at 8:35 pm
RE: Morality - by NoMoreFaith - April 16, 2012 at 5:54 am
RE: Morality - by King_Charles - April 16, 2012 at 6:29 am
RE: Morality - by Kratos - April 16, 2012 at 6:55 am
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 16, 2012 at 7:10 am
RE: Morality - by Kratos - April 16, 2012 at 8:40 pm
RE: Morality - by parttimeprojectionist - April 16, 2012 at 7:34 am
RE: Morality - by Drich - April 16, 2012 at 9:12 am
RE: Morality - by NoMoreFaith - April 16, 2012 at 8:54 am
RE: Morality - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2012 at 9:02 am
RE: Morality - by Zen Badger - April 16, 2012 at 9:04 am
RE: Morality - by Coveredone - April 16, 2012 at 9:37 am
RE: Morality - by Tobie - April 16, 2012 at 9:48 am
RE: Morality - by parttimeprojectionist - April 16, 2012 at 5:07 pm
RE: Morality - by Norfolk And Chance - April 16, 2012 at 5:33 pm
RE: Morality - by LiberalHearted - April 16, 2012 at 8:40 pm
RE: Morality - by parttimeprojectionist - April 16, 2012 at 5:35 pm
RE: Morality - by Norfolk And Chance - April 16, 2012 at 8:33 pm
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 17, 2012 at 1:46 am
RE: Morality - by Reforged - April 17, 2012 at 1:56 am
RE: Morality - by Kratos - April 17, 2012 at 4:04 am
RE: Morality - by FallentoReason - April 17, 2012 at 4:23 am
RE: Morality - by Kratos - April 17, 2012 at 6:10 am
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 17, 2012 at 6:08 am
RE: Morality - by Kratos - April 17, 2012 at 6:00 pm
RE: Morality - by Nine - April 17, 2012 at 6:04 pm
RE: Morality - by Creed of Heresy - April 18, 2012 at 12:58 am

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