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A good case against God
#5
RE: A good case against God
(July 3, 2012 at 2:59 am)Jeffonthenet Wrote:
(July 3, 2012 at 2:39 am)Tempus Wrote: I don't make cases against things if there's no reason to believe them to begin with. There's plenty of good reasons not to accept popular arguments for gods though.

A statement that there is no reason to believe God exists is not an argument against God…

I'm not sure whether you understood the first sentence of my reply. It wasn't intended as an argument; it was, as you correctly identified, a statement.

(July 3, 2012 at 2:59 am)Jeffonthenet Wrote: Even if there were no good arguments for God, which I don't think I need to grant given arguments such as the Kalaam Cosmological argument and the Moral Argument (from the existence of objective moral values to God) it would not follow that there is no God.

You're right. If there were no good arguments (or any arguments at all) it wouldn't follow that there are no gods, since arguments don't affect reality. It would follow, however, that there's no good reasons to believe there are gods. Just because there's no good reason to believe X it doesn't mean that X isn't true. Observing this fact doesn't strengthen a case for gods any more than it does for a tooth fairy.

By the way, the Kalam and moral arguments suck, frankly. The former is like a child took a five minute crash course in philosophy and came up with it.
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Messages In This Thread
A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 3, 2012 at 2:34 am
RE: A good case against God - by Tempus - July 3, 2012 at 2:39 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 3, 2012 at 2:59 am
RE: A good case against God - by Chuff - July 3, 2012 at 3:44 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 3, 2012 at 9:38 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 3, 2012 at 1:32 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Tempus - July 3, 2012 at 3:51 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 3, 2012 at 9:46 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 3, 2012 at 1:50 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 5, 2012 at 11:13 am
RE: A good case against God - by frankiej - July 5, 2012 at 11:22 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 5, 2012 at 12:56 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 6, 2012 at 1:22 am
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 6, 2012 at 10:48 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 9, 2012 at 1:03 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Tempus - July 3, 2012 at 9:28 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 3, 2012 at 1:26 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 4, 2012 at 1:41 am
RE: A good case against God - by padraic - July 3, 2012 at 3:57 am
RE: A good case against God - by Forsaken - July 3, 2012 at 4:21 am
RE: A good case against God - by The Theist - July 4, 2012 at 1:54 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 10:33 am
RE: A good case against God - by The Theist - July 4, 2012 at 11:41 am
RE: A good case against God - by Fidel_Castronaut - July 4, 2012 at 11:51 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 1:06 pm
RE: A good case against God - by joe terlizzi - July 3, 2012 at 4:25 am
RE: A good case against God - by Forsaken - July 3, 2012 at 4:34 am
RE: A good case against God - by LastPoet - July 3, 2012 at 4:42 am
RE: A good case against God - by Ace Otana - July 3, 2012 at 4:45 am
RE: A good case against God - by zebo-the-fat - July 3, 2012 at 4:57 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 3, 2012 at 10:06 am
RE: A good case against God - by Thor - July 3, 2012 at 11:06 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 3, 2012 at 2:05 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Justtristo - July 3, 2012 at 6:01 am
RE: A good case against God - by Zen Badger - July 3, 2012 at 6:33 am
RE: A good case against God - by KichigaiNeko - July 3, 2012 at 9:40 am
RE: A good case against God - by KichigaiNeko - July 3, 2012 at 9:59 am
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 3, 2012 at 11:39 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 3, 2012 at 1:05 pm
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 3, 2012 at 1:17 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 4, 2012 at 1:21 am
RE: A good case against God - by Xyster - July 4, 2012 at 1:29 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jackalope - July 4, 2012 at 1:50 am
RE: A good case against God - by Xyster - July 4, 2012 at 4:45 am
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 4, 2012 at 12:49 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 3, 2012 at 1:31 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jackalope - July 3, 2012 at 1:37 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 4, 2012 at 10:14 am
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 4, 2012 at 10:47 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 3, 2012 at 2:41 pm
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 3, 2012 at 12:41 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 3, 2012 at 1:19 pm
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 3, 2012 at 1:23 pm
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 3, 2012 at 10:31 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 3, 2012 at 12:46 pm
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 3, 2012 at 1:09 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jackalope - July 3, 2012 at 1:09 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 4, 2012 at 12:08 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jackalope - July 4, 2012 at 12:40 am
RE: A good case against God - by Thor - July 3, 2012 at 1:55 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 5, 2012 at 11:30 am
RE: A good case against God - by LastPoet - July 5, 2012 at 12:29 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Simon Moon - July 5, 2012 at 12:36 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Thor - July 5, 2012 at 12:51 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Tempus - July 5, 2012 at 11:44 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Cato - July 5, 2012 at 11:46 pm
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 3, 2012 at 12:54 pm
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 3, 2012 at 1:04 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 3, 2012 at 1:10 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 4, 2012 at 12:33 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 3:00 am
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 10:05 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 10:20 am
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 11:06 am
RE: A good case against God - by Fidel_Castronaut - July 4, 2012 at 11:19 am
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 11:23 am
RE: A good case against God - by Fidel_Castronaut - July 4, 2012 at 11:28 am
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 12:02 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Fidel_Castronaut - July 4, 2012 at 12:33 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 12:43 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 1:02 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 2:01 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 2:15 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 2:44 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 2:54 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 4, 2012 at 11:45 am
RE: A good case against God - by The Theist - July 4, 2012 at 11:53 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 12:17 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 12:35 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 1:29 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 1:43 pm
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 4, 2012 at 2:02 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 2:25 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 2:42 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 3:37 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Fidel_Castronaut - July 4, 2012 at 2:05 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 2:29 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 4, 2012 at 11:23 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 11:59 am
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 3, 2012 at 1:36 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Simon Moon - July 3, 2012 at 2:37 pm
RE: A good case against God - by MysticKnight - July 3, 2012 at 8:01 pm
RE: A good case against God - by padraic - July 3, 2012 at 8:05 pm
RE: A good case against God - by MysticKnight - July 3, 2012 at 9:24 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jackalope - July 3, 2012 at 9:27 pm
RE: A good case against God - by MysticKnight - July 3, 2012 at 10:26 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jackalope - July 3, 2012 at 11:50 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Reforged - July 3, 2012 at 9:30 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Epimethean - July 3, 2012 at 10:12 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Reforged - July 4, 2012 at 12:10 am
RE: A good case against God - by Xyster - July 4, 2012 at 12:56 am
RE: A good case against God - by The Theist - July 4, 2012 at 1:44 am
RE: A good case against God - by popeyespappy - July 4, 2012 at 10:26 am
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 4, 2012 at 8:18 am
RE: A good case against God - by Ace Otana - July 4, 2012 at 8:42 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 4, 2012 at 12:50 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 1:07 pm
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 4, 2012 at 1:12 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 1:15 pm
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 4, 2012 at 1:15 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 1:27 pm
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 4, 2012 at 1:35 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 4, 2012 at 1:28 pm
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 4, 2012 at 1:21 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 4, 2012 at 2:32 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 2:45 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 4:41 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Faith No More - July 4, 2012 at 2:53 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Faith No More - July 4, 2012 at 2:56 pm
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 4, 2012 at 3:13 pm
RE: A good case against God - by The Theist - July 4, 2012 at 3:57 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 5, 2012 at 11:09 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Epimethean - July 4, 2012 at 3:00 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Epimethean - July 4, 2012 at 4:03 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 4, 2012 at 4:25 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Faith No More - July 4, 2012 at 4:36 pm
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 5, 2012 at 11:59 am
RE: A good case against God - by Epimethean - July 6, 2012 at 10:30 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 9, 2012 at 11:42 am
RE: A good case against God - by LastPoet - July 9, 2012 at 1:50 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 10, 2012 at 11:30 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Mister Agenda - July 11, 2012 at 11:01 am
RE: A good case against God - by Thor - July 11, 2012 at 11:08 am
RE: A good case against God - by Cato - July 10, 2012 at 2:49 am
RE: A good case against God - by The Grand Nudger - July 6, 2012 at 10:33 am
RE: A good case against God - by Mister Agenda - July 6, 2012 at 11:48 am
RE: A good case against God - by CliveStaples - July 6, 2012 at 11:55 am
RE: A good case against God - by The Grand Nudger - July 6, 2012 at 12:33 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Opsnyder - July 9, 2012 at 2:26 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 10, 2012 at 12:34 am
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 10, 2012 at 2:47 am
RE: A good case against God - by Epimethean - July 10, 2012 at 7:15 am
RE: A good case against God - by NickB - July 10, 2012 at 7:59 am
RE: A good case against God - by Ace Otana - July 10, 2012 at 8:24 am
RE: A good case against God - by LastPoet - July 10, 2012 at 8:42 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 11, 2012 at 2:41 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 10, 2012 at 8:10 am
RE: A good case against God - by NickB - July 10, 2012 at 8:42 am
RE: A good case against God - by Ace Otana - July 10, 2012 at 8:59 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 10, 2012 at 1:15 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Mister Agenda - July 10, 2012 at 2:32 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 11, 2012 at 4:25 am
RE: A good case against God - by NickB - July 10, 2012 at 8:57 am
RE: A good case against God - by frankiej - July 10, 2012 at 9:01 am
RE: A good case against God - by Ace Otana - July 10, 2012 at 9:02 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 10, 2012 at 9:06 am
RE: A good case against God - by NickB - July 10, 2012 at 9:43 am
RE: A good case against God - by Ace Otana - July 10, 2012 at 9:56 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 10, 2012 at 9:58 am
RE: A good case against God - by Thor - July 10, 2012 at 10:31 am
RE: A good case against God - by frankiej - July 10, 2012 at 9:54 am
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - July 10, 2012 at 1:26 pm
RE: A good case against God - by NickB - July 10, 2012 at 10:16 am
RE: A good case against God - by Ace Otana - July 10, 2012 at 10:45 am
RE: A good case against God - by Skepsis - July 11, 2012 at 12:05 am
RE: A good case against God - by Reforged - July 10, 2012 at 1:06 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Kayenneh - July 10, 2012 at 1:24 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Kayenneh - July 10, 2012 at 1:27 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 10, 2012 at 1:31 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Kayenneh - July 10, 2012 at 1:42 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Epimethean - July 10, 2012 at 11:46 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 11, 2012 at 12:27 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 11, 2012 at 12:17 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 11, 2012 at 12:58 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 11, 2012 at 1:09 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 11, 2012 at 1:28 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 11, 2012 at 1:45 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 11, 2012 at 2:00 am
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 11, 2012 at 2:09 am
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - July 11, 2012 at 3:46 am
RE: A good case against God - by Tempus - July 11, 2012 at 2:32 am
RE: A good case against God - by jonb - July 11, 2012 at 5:30 am
RE: A good case against God - by Whateverist - July 11, 2012 at 8:45 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 11, 2012 at 11:30 am
RE: A good case against God - by Thor - July 11, 2012 at 12:15 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 11, 2012 at 2:34 pm
RE: A good case against God - by jonb - July 14, 2012 at 5:05 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 14, 2012 at 8:51 am
RE: A good case against God - by KnockEmOuttt - July 11, 2012 at 2:37 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Jeffonthenet - July 14, 2012 at 1:48 am
RE: A good case against God - by Taqiyya Mockingbird - July 14, 2012 at 6:06 am
RE: A good case against God - by KnockEmOuttt - July 14, 2012 at 5:27 am
RE: A good case against God - by Brian37 - May 8, 2013 at 11:54 am
RE: A good case against God - by downbeatplumb - May 8, 2013 at 1:40 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Darkstar - May 8, 2013 at 3:16 pm
RE: A good case against God - by FallentoReason - May 8, 2013 at 10:25 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Fidel_Castronaut - May 9, 2013 at 6:41 am
RE: A good case against God - by Arellius - May 15, 2013 at 8:03 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Esquilax - May 15, 2013 at 8:50 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Arellius - May 15, 2013 at 8:57 pm
RE: A good case against God - by Esquilax - May 15, 2013 at 9:12 pm

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