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Prayer?
RE: Prayer?
(August 11, 2012 at 12:51 am)RaphielDrake Wrote:
(August 11, 2012 at 12:28 am)RaphielDrake Wrote: ... are you joking?
(August 11, 2012 at 12:43 am)Undeceived Wrote: Let's put it this way. You're a father. Your 2-year-old son refuses to change his mind about anything, ever. You plead with him, telling him you are more experienced and know what's best for him. He demands ice cream every day, won't thank you for it, and is quickly becoming the most unhealthy child on the planet. What would you (God) do?
Right ok, lets replace the childs demand for ice-cream, which by the way is a rather stupid comparison but whatever, with "Help me Daddy, I'm dying from starvation and aids in a poverty stricken country."
What then?
You're still demanding physical, trivial things. God, our Father, provides for our spiritual needs. It is as if the child is seeking toys like legos for his own personal world in his room, as opposed to real life necessities. Life is in place to point us to God. Sufferings are only as bad as your feelings about them--until they reach the point where you die. And death is just the beginning of eternity in heaven. What's more, once we get to heaven we'll realize how many "sufferings" we had every day, just in different form. You look at famine and consider it worse than whatever you experience. Ask a poor individual if they feel their lives are multiplicatively tougher. On what do you base your standard for a good life? Do you consider your American life better, and are you more content for it? Why do studies show many impoverished families to be happier than millionaires? Or is it your outlook that matters? Your feelings and expectations are like glasses through which you see the world. If we don't worry our next meal, we find something else to worry and stress about, like how irritating a co-worker is. Shouldn't we just be grateful to have a job? You expect an African family to be grateful. The moment an African family steps into an American lifestyle, their standards change. They become dissatisfied with the quality of their schools or how far a drive work is. Now turn this African family into Billionaires. Their mint coat ripped, and they're shouting at the dry cleaner for being so klutzy! Their Ferrari was keyed last night. Oh dear, we need to get it repaired first thing in the morning! Even if everyone on this forum comes from similar circumstances, you can't use that common condition as a basis for what life should be. "Our way" is not "the way." Just how few sufferings would it take for you to entertain the notion of a good God? Everyone middle-income? All of us sitting on plush chairs drinking magically-appearing slurpies? Draw a line. How far must God interfere with the free order of things to be considered worth worshiping?
The problem with debating "sufferings" is the assumed definition of what a suffering is. You pick massive human needs like starvation and poverty in an attempt to get me on common ground. The discussion would be more fruitful with terms like "earthly contentment" and "spiritual fulfillment." I hope I've made it clear that anybody, even a poor and hungry person, can be content on earth. And everyone can find spiritual fulfillment in Christ's death and resurrection.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 12:16 am
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 3, 2012 at 12:27 am
RE: Prayer? - by Jackalope - August 3, 2012 at 12:32 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 5:34 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 3, 2012 at 6:06 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 6:59 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 3, 2012 at 12:34 am
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 3, 2012 at 1:03 am
RE: Prayer? - by FallentoReason - August 3, 2012 at 1:05 am
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 3, 2012 at 2:01 am
RE: Prayer? - by C.W. Sims - August 3, 2012 at 12:29 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 6:11 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 3, 2012 at 9:22 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cinjin - August 5, 2012 at 8:52 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 5, 2012 at 1:26 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 5, 2012 at 9:44 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 5, 2012 at 10:17 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 3, 2012 at 6:33 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 3, 2012 at 12:37 am
RE: Prayer? - by FallentoReason - August 3, 2012 at 12:50 am
RE: Prayer? - by C.W. Sims - August 3, 2012 at 12:55 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 6:03 pm
RE: Prayer? - by C.W. Sims - August 3, 2012 at 6:31 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 10:09 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 4, 2012 at 1:47 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 4, 2012 at 11:19 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 4, 2012 at 11:28 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 6, 2012 at 4:06 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Godschild - August 5, 2012 at 2:24 am
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 6, 2012 at 4:43 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 3, 2012 at 1:10 am
RE: Prayer? - by Shell B - August 3, 2012 at 1:29 am
RE: Prayer? - by Zen Badger - August 3, 2012 at 6:41 am
RE: Prayer? - by KichigaiNeko - August 3, 2012 at 7:21 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 3, 2012 at 12:44 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Anomalocaris - August 3, 2012 at 12:51 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 3, 2012 at 12:53 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Godschild - August 3, 2012 at 1:20 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 3, 2012 at 2:00 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Godschild - August 4, 2012 at 1:57 am
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 4, 2012 at 7:05 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Whateverist - August 3, 2012 at 1:17 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Anomalocaris - August 3, 2012 at 1:26 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 3, 2012 at 1:27 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Annik - August 3, 2012 at 2:08 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Anomalocaris - August 3, 2012 at 2:11 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Whateverist - August 3, 2012 at 2:29 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 3, 2012 at 2:12 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 3, 2012 at 5:35 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 3, 2012 at 5:53 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Whateverist - August 3, 2012 at 5:55 pm
RE: Prayer? - by pgrimes15 - August 5, 2012 at 7:40 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 5, 2012 at 1:01 pm
RE: Prayer? - by downbeatplumb - August 5, 2012 at 1:15 pm
RE: Prayer? - by pgrimes15 - August 5, 2012 at 2:40 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 5, 2012 at 3:02 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 5, 2012 at 6:36 pm
RE: Prayer? - by C.W. Sims - August 3, 2012 at 5:41 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 6:47 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Whateverist - August 3, 2012 at 6:57 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 3, 2012 at 6:52 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 3, 2012 at 7:00 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 7:10 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 3, 2012 at 7:19 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 7:33 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 3, 2012 at 7:34 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 3, 2012 at 9:59 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Whateverist - August 4, 2012 at 12:56 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 3, 2012 at 7:47 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 3, 2012 at 10:05 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 4, 2012 at 1:59 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cato - August 4, 2012 at 6:37 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 4, 2012 at 7:19 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 4, 2012 at 11:32 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 4, 2012 at 11:38 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 4, 2012 at 11:50 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 5, 2012 at 10:22 am
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 4, 2012 at 7:47 pm
RE: Prayer? - by KichigaiNeko - August 5, 2012 at 7:45 am
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 5, 2012 at 1:55 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 5, 2012 at 6:25 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 5, 2012 at 3:02 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 5, 2012 at 3:19 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 5, 2012 at 3:24 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Erinome - August 5, 2012 at 3:39 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Deicide73 - August 5, 2012 at 6:14 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 5, 2012 at 6:32 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 5, 2012 at 6:46 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 5, 2012 at 11:01 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 12:34 am
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 6, 2012 at 2:14 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 12:26 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 6, 2012 at 2:16 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 4:08 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 6, 2012 at 10:20 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 11:15 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 7, 2012 at 12:17 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 5, 2012 at 6:45 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 5, 2012 at 7:54 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 5, 2012 at 9:33 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 5, 2012 at 9:06 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 5, 2012 at 10:31 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 12:18 am
RE: Prayer? - by Epimethean - August 6, 2012 at 12:27 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 6, 2012 at 12:43 am
RE: Prayer? - by Whateverist - August 6, 2012 at 1:18 am
RE: Prayer? - by KichigaiNeko - August 6, 2012 at 2:21 am
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 6, 2012 at 8:44 am
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 6, 2012 at 9:15 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 11:08 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 6, 2012 at 1:53 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 2:44 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Epimethean - August 6, 2012 at 10:34 am
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 6, 2012 at 1:13 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 6, 2012 at 2:34 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Erinome - August 6, 2012 at 2:51 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cinjin - August 6, 2012 at 11:02 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 6, 2012 at 2:54 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 4:20 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 6, 2012 at 4:16 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 6, 2012 at 4:43 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 9:29 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 6, 2012 at 9:49 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 10:14 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 6, 2012 at 11:03 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 6, 2012 at 9:34 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 9:36 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 6, 2012 at 9:43 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 10:22 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 6, 2012 at 10:22 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cinjin - August 6, 2012 at 11:06 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 6, 2012 at 11:23 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 6, 2012 at 11:37 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 6, 2012 at 11:43 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 7, 2012 at 1:05 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 7, 2012 at 4:11 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 7, 2012 at 6:38 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 7, 2012 at 8:17 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 7, 2012 at 11:08 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 8, 2012 at 1:22 am
RE: Prayer? - by Whateverist - August 7, 2012 at 4:49 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Epimethean - August 7, 2012 at 12:30 am
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 7, 2012 at 4:14 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 7, 2012 at 6:45 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 7, 2012 at 10:00 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 8, 2012 at 1:30 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cato - August 8, 2012 at 2:09 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 8, 2012 at 4:03 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 9, 2012 at 12:14 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 9, 2012 at 11:37 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 8, 2012 at 1:52 am
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 8, 2012 at 3:54 am
RE: Prayer? - by Anomalocaris - August 8, 2012 at 2:19 am
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 8, 2012 at 4:31 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 8, 2012 at 11:09 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 12, 2012 at 1:06 am
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 9, 2012 at 12:17 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 9, 2012 at 12:27 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 9, 2012 at 12:32 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 10, 2012 at 12:04 am
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 10, 2012 at 12:54 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cato - August 10, 2012 at 10:32 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 10, 2012 at 12:00 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 10, 2012 at 9:28 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 10, 2012 at 1:17 am
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 10, 2012 at 7:40 am
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 10, 2012 at 3:12 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 10, 2012 at 12:03 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 10, 2012 at 10:37 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 10, 2012 at 11:12 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 10, 2012 at 11:40 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 11, 2012 at 12:24 am
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 11, 2012 at 12:28 am
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 11, 2012 at 12:43 am
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 11, 2012 at 12:51 am
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 11, 2012 at 12:45 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 11, 2012 at 9:13 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 11, 2012 at 12:59 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 11, 2012 at 12:53 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 11, 2012 at 1:27 am
RE: Prayer? - by ElDinero - August 11, 2012 at 4:56 am
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 11, 2012 at 3:08 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 11, 2012 at 5:56 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 11, 2012 at 3:27 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 11, 2012 at 4:52 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 11, 2012 at 6:04 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 11, 2012 at 9:22 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 11, 2012 at 10:20 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 11, 2012 at 10:55 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 12, 2012 at 12:02 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 12, 2012 at 12:11 am
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 12, 2012 at 12:40 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 12, 2012 at 5:15 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Tobie - August 12, 2012 at 5:17 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 13, 2012 at 9:31 am
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 13, 2012 at 1:06 am
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 13, 2012 at 1:09 am
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 13, 2012 at 1:22 am
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 13, 2012 at 1:27 am
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 13, 2012 at 1:42 am
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 13, 2012 at 12:06 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 13, 2012 at 12:48 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 13, 2012 at 12:58 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 13, 2012 at 3:28 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 13, 2012 at 8:24 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 14, 2012 at 10:21 am
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 14, 2012 at 1:35 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 14, 2012 at 2:04 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 14, 2012 at 2:46 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 14, 2012 at 6:36 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 15, 2012 at 12:23 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 16, 2012 at 9:00 am
RE: Prayer? - by Thor - August 16, 2012 at 4:36 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 16, 2012 at 7:31 pm
RE: Prayer? - by ElDinero - August 12, 2012 at 6:03 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 12, 2012 at 5:31 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 12, 2012 at 5:46 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 12, 2012 at 10:47 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 13, 2012 at 12:50 am
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 13, 2012 at 1:32 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 13, 2012 at 4:30 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 14, 2012 at 9:14 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 14, 2012 at 12:56 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Skepsis - August 14, 2012 at 8:11 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 14, 2012 at 1:58 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 13, 2012 at 5:56 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Zen Badger - August 12, 2012 at 7:16 am
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 12, 2012 at 11:34 am
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 12, 2012 at 4:52 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Tobie - August 12, 2012 at 5:11 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Gambit - August 12, 2012 at 12:13 am
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 12, 2012 at 9:26 am
RE: Prayer? - by WhatIfGodWasJustAMyth - August 12, 2012 at 4:29 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 12, 2012 at 5:17 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 13, 2012 at 10:40 am
RE: Prayer? - by Undeceived - August 13, 2012 at 12:19 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 13, 2012 at 12:30 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 13, 2012 at 6:13 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Faith No More - August 13, 2012 at 7:40 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 13, 2012 at 10:27 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 12:10 am
RE: Prayer? - by Tobie - August 14, 2012 at 3:26 am
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 14, 2012 at 8:25 am
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 8:40 am
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 10:48 am
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 14, 2012 at 2:03 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 14, 2012 at 5:27 pm
RE: Prayer? - by padraic - August 16, 2012 at 9:39 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Jackalope - August 16, 2012 at 11:50 am
RE: Prayer? - by Epimethean - August 16, 2012 at 9:19 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 19, 2012 at 2:06 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Reforged - August 20, 2012 at 7:31 am
RE: Prayer? - by FallentoReason - August 21, 2012 at 2:31 am
RE: Prayer? - by Lion IRC - August 23, 2012 at 2:38 am
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 21, 2012 at 6:16 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 18, 2012 at 4:49 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 19, 2012 at 2:32 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Epimethean - August 20, 2012 at 6:40 am
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 20, 2012 at 4:30 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 20, 2012 at 11:08 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 20, 2012 at 11:13 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 21, 2012 at 8:51 am
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 21, 2012 at 4:01 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 21, 2012 at 5:24 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 21, 2012 at 5:44 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Drich - August 21, 2012 at 5:58 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Minimalist - August 20, 2012 at 11:21 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Ryantology - August 21, 2012 at 2:35 am
RE: Prayer? - by Epimethean - August 21, 2012 at 9:23 am
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 21, 2012 at 5:35 pm
RE: Prayer? - by The Grand Nudger - August 21, 2012 at 6:06 pm
RE: Prayer? - by Cyberman - August 23, 2012 at 10:01 am

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