Big Bang Theory

[Truth Matters]

You missed the qualifier. Absolute PHYSICAL beginning. There can be no absolute beginning. Nothing cannot cause something to exist.
The PHYSICAL Universe BEGAN to exist. It needs a non-physical causal agency.
Got it?

But the big bang is a state, and as seems likely it has a cause that was inngendered by the state that existed, so it cannot even be said to be the beginning, but merely a transition, It seems you are trying to make out the big bang as being the moment of creation, but the big bag does not fit that as there was already a physical existence, and in string theory there are many other universes with physical existence that effect this one, that are not part of the big bang state that this universe went through.

The problem with your position as I understand it is that you are trying to justify your religion, with natural philosophy, but they have very different systems of logic, and as such there are no proven connections, to say this thing in this one, 'creation' could be the same as that state in the other the 'big bang' is a hopeless bit of silliness.

I have not as yet come across, a scientific theory about how primary existence began, although there is some speculation that there is no primal cause.

Science can show, the world is older than six or ten thousand years, so as such we can assert a literal interpretation of the bable is an untenable position within science.

In short you can assert there is a god, but you cannot use science to prove it. As such your series of assertions on this thread are meaningless.

Jonb,
The 'Big Bang' is the absolute physical beginning. This is simply unavoidable. That's exactly what the models predict and fully confirm. The fact that many committed philosophical Naturalists (Atheists) in science desperately want to obscure the absolute physical beginning has no bearing on the fact.

These wild metaphysical speculations offered by committed Atheists in science such as String, M, quantum loop, oscillation, no boundaries models all have failed to avoid the absolute physical beginning of our Universe. None have any empirical evidence or have enjoyed any verification success. They exist exclusively in the minds of theoretical physicists committed to Atheism / Naturalism. Ironically, M-Theory multiverse models exist as a last line of defense against the Design Inference from Fine Tuning confirmations of the 1970's (another extremely potent line of evidence for Design)

There is no scientific theory of the causal conditions of the physical dimensions because it's fundamentally beyond the scope of science. It's simply inaccessible to the scientific endeavor. Physical Science stops cold at the beginning of physical existence - the beginning of our physical dimension. This does not mean reason needs to stop. We know a rational order (an property of mind btw) is imposed on the Universe. Ironically, this is the philosophical assumption upon which Christians rested their development of the Empirical method (Francis Bacon, etc).

The Bible does not present us with a 6000 year old earth. That is simply a modern construct based on a wooden literal interpretation on what is obviously allegory. It's a shame that so many hold to this notion. Heck, we are still in the seventh day - it never ended. It's obviously a reference to era's.

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[quote='Minimalist' pid='360444' dateline='1352434834']

That's what their fucking bible says, Stim.



Theists invent a god to give simple solutions to complex problems. You are obviously satisfied with that. But the Big Bang Theory says that "About 15 billion years ago a tremendous explosion started the expansion of the universe. This explosion is known as the Big Bang. At the point of this event all of the matter and energy of space was contained at one point.

Now...I know this is difficult for a mind which is content to have a bearded old man winking everything into existence but the Big Bang is not nothing. It is EVERYTHING. All matter and energy.

So kindly blow jesus out your ass.

Actually, the Big Bang event was around 13.7 - 13.8 B years ago.
The physical science of Big Bang ends at the singularity - when all matter and energy come into existence.

Spanky, I realize you have been duped by those you trust, but there was no 'single point' in space where some infinitely dense - zero sized 'pellet' existed and exploded. THERE WAS NO SPACE!. Physical space, time and matter began at the physical boundary we call the singularity.

You need to embrace reality. Science matters. Wild metaphysical stories told by committed Atheists in science don't matter.

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[quote='jonb' pid='360571' dateline='1352465161']
In short you can assert there is a god, but you cannot use science to prove it. As such your series of assertions on this thread are meaningless.

Not to mention that the interpretation of the theories on which TMs position lies has been thoroughly debunked, We covered it all here: http://atheistforums.org/thread-15324.html

To corrupt a meme, "That theory, it does not mean what you think it means"

Then actually debunk me - don't just claim it happened somewhere with some link. Tell me exactly where I am wrong on the science?
Try to debunk my arguments and watch how badly things end for you. I guarantee it.