The Case for Theism

[Drew_2013]

So Drew, I think a better question is, why should anyone bother debating you at all, when everyone can just go to the "suppose science proves god exists?" thread and A: Watch you get your ass kicked all around the debating floor, and B: Observe each and every dishonest tactic you seem to pride yourself on using? What would be the point?

If you don't want to play take your marbles and go home. But I'll let others decide who kicked whose ass.

You are under the delusion that because you say something, that makes it so. What are these other options you refer to? If you want to claim I am spouting a false dichotomy then man up and say something other than because I say so.

For the sake of new folks viewing this thread, the 'false dichotomy' I am alleged to have made is that all phemonmena or events are either the result of plan and design or happenstance. I contend that we either owe our existence to a planner and designer who intentionally created the universe for the purpose of creating life or the fact of our existence and that of the universe was an unplanned event that occurred not intentionally but by happenstance.

Well, okay: how about a metastable universe that existed eternally and had no beginning or an end? You're claiming that it's possible with god, after all.

No I never said anything about the nature of the existence of God. Such a universe wasn't caused intentionally, wasn't planned and didn't intend humans or life to exist right? Explain to me how apart from mind and intent anything can occur that isn't by happenstance?

Or the multiple worlds hypothesis, where our universe would have sprung up as a reaction to a divergence in any number of parallel realities? No random happenstance there, and also no god.

Did the universe that sprung up as a reaction to a divergence due so intentionally? Minus a personal agent who intentionally caused it to occur wasn't the event an unguided, unplanned occurance?

That took me about thirty seconds of honest thought, but as we've all seen, you're more interested in gross simplifications that aid your single interpretation over the actual truth.

No, if you really took some time to think about it you'd realize that if something isn't intentionally created, planned or designed to happen, if there is no thinking agent behind the wheel steering the car it goes off in a haphazard unplanned fashion. Sure if it hits a rock we might predict it will turn in a certain direction...but it didn't plan to hit the rock, the rock didn't intentionally throw itself in the path. I think most reasonable people would agree with me the dichotomy isn't false, that if something isn't planned intentionally, then it occurs unplanned and undesigned which is the same as by happenstance. How something could happen without plan or intent yet also not by happenstance appears to be a conundrum.