What Sacrifice ?

[pocaracas]

1. How would you know that?

It is a part of the religion that we are assuming in this thread.

Oh yeah... I sometimes forget we're playing make belief... sorry about that.

2. How would you know that?

Eyewitness accounts, mostly. They spread the news, the wrote, then kept spreading. Romans thought they were a danger to the empire because of such rapid expansion. More evidence than for the existence of Cleopatra or Socrates.

yeah... about those eyewitness accounts.
I'm not a scholar, nor do I know a lot about the bible, but there a few people around here who question the origin of those accounts...
I don't know, maybe there was a J.C., but the written accounts ended up exaggerating some of the things the man did...

3. And how would you know all that?
Why the Jesuits? Why is it that christians (and practically all other religions) want to reach out and let everyone know about this religion?

I explained how I know that in what you quoted. There are "transcendentals" that God literally is. A reverence of Order is a reverence of God. And I am surprised you know how the Jesuits work, but I am not even Catholic. However, the Jesuits are correct here. There is no reason why we should limit God to only being able to do work in the way we are accustomed to. I'm not saying that this indirect reverence works 100%, but I will say this is another way my God can save. Knowing my God, I believe he uses it as often as he can. Knowing people, I doubt he can use it often. Therefore, since this is an indirect way of worship, evangelization is good because it can bring about a more full worship of God.

I see it as gathering more people to the cult, so as to have more positive reinforcement of the notion that has no physical evidence.... If you see enough people believing the same thing, you end up accepting it easily.

I meant people. Why is it that people have to keep convincing other people about the existence of this divinity?
If only the deity could handle that part...

Oh, that makes more sense. God doesn't "require" people, but yes, he strictly uses people. Catholics will say some saints will show up to people, but I don't buy that. There are no more dramatic miracles (God talking or some superpower or another) because that isn't supposed to be the base of faith. The knowledge of God's existence does not save a single person. God could have angels sing about the good things he's doing for us every day, and that would not save a single person. No one would deny God's existence, but faith is not existence. It's a relationship (a trust at the most basic of levels).

Sooo... why is it that the holy book essentially has accounts of those miracles?
Why is it that those accounts concern people who, allegedly, had first hand knowledge of that god, but we don't need it?

5. I don't see how your reply follows from my question, but ok.... I must be in some sleep deprived state...

Belief is required because it is the most basic connection we can have with God. It gives him something to work with.

Hundreds of thousands of years ago, mankind knew nothing about the christian god.
How did it work with them?

YHWH is not my god.... I have no god. Even if there was only one god, the concept of "having a god" shouldn't make any sense.... but humans have different opinions about the divine entities, leading to "having" different gods... clearly a man-made proposition, no?

You have a God in the same way that you have a father. This probably isn't what you're speaking about. Ya, there are lots of "gods". That's even recorded in the bible. Worshiping things that are not God is idolatry. What we claim, just like they do, is that our God is the one that actually exists. They "have" what they have made (idea, wooden statue, etc.) and we "have" what made us.

Aye, you claim yours is the one that actually exists.
So do and did all other religions and cults.
What makes your so real, given that all we see it working with is people's faith?

Well, I think the workings of our brains are deterministic, being heavily based on genetics, upbringing and any information that arrives to them at every moment of our lives. With all the billions of neurons and possible connections between them, we are left with a brain as a very complex machine, which leads to the appearance of what you call "free will", or "soul" as a separate entity from the brain itself.

The workings of our brains are largely deterministic. Light goes in eyes, data is collected, and the neurons transfer the data everywhere. I discussed one of my reasons for all animals having souls on another thread, but If you wanna start a free will vs determinism thread I'll chime in.

That's been done to death in this forum... over and over again. No need for another thread on the same subject:
https://atheistforums.org/thread-14995-p...#pid344211

https://atheistforums.org/thread-14455-p...#pid330788

You may notice a common theme on my questions...