(March 5, 2013 at 6:57 pm)Drew_2013 Wrote: >snip shed-load of excess verbiage<
There are two primary reasons I am a theist. First because there are facts (evidence) that supports that belief.
And that evidence is?
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*whistles*
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*taps foot*
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*crickets*
Right. Moving on.
(March 5, 2013 at 6:57 pm)Drew_2013 Wrote: Secondly if I were to reject the belief that God created the universe and humans I would have to be persuaded that mindless lifeless forces somehow coughed a universe into existence and without plan or intent caused the right conditions for life to occur. I'd have to believe that life and mind without plan or intent emerged from something totally unlike itself, mindless lifeless forces.
This is called the Argument from Personal Incredulity. It's a logical fallacy. And that's just the beginning of its fractal fallaciousness. First of all, if "life and mind" require another instance of "life and mind" to produce them, who created your god? Since he is presumably much bigger, more impressive, more complex, etc. than humans, his existence must necessarily represent an even greater wonder than ours, and thus require a super-supernatural explanation, by your "logic."
Second, complex structures arise without the aid of humanoid designers all the time. Snowflakes form exquisite, individually unique, intricate geometric forms, from shapeless water "totally unlike themselves," through the mindless, lifeless forces of thermodynamics (the water loses heat) and molecular bonds. There are no Snowflake Faeries with tiny chisels carving out each little masterpiece. Google "cymatics" and watch the videos, and you will see multiple examples of complex geometric forms, animated moving shapes, even eerily life-like "organisms" created by applying sound waves to ductile materials (water, lycopodium powder, various pastes).
(March 5, 2013 at 6:57 pm)Drew_2013 Wrote: >snip more shed-loads of excess verbiage containing no evidence or arguments<
The first line of evidence is.
1. The fact the universe exists
>snip...crikey! Learn to. Get. To. The. Point!<
In order for anyone to even think God exists a place for humans to exist must exist.
Wherever do you get the idea that the Cosmos was created for us? Humans can live on part of one-third of the surface of the Earth. Dolphins can live on (in) two-thirds of the Earth's surface. Therefore, the Cosmos was created by the great Goddess Ekikikikikak'k'reeEEEEEEEEeeee! (Peace be upon Her Holy Flukes) Right?
But wait, it gets worse. Earth is an inconceivably tiny little speck orbiting one little star out of about 400 billion stars that compose one galaxy of at least 100 billion galaxies. Humans' tenure on Earth--about 200,000 years at the longest--is a mere rounding error in the 14 billion year history of the Cosmos. 99.999999999999999999999999999999999+ percent of the Cosmos is lethal to human life; either vacuum and hard radiation, barren rocky planets hard radiation and/or poison atmospheres, gas giants with poison atmospheres and not even anywhere to stand...plus hard radiation, deadly storms, too much gravity, and powerful (enough to be deadly) magnetic fields. That's before you get to the really scary stuff, like black holes, quasars, gamma ray bursts, neutron stars, supernova explosions...
On top of all that, it's all so mind-bogglingly far away we can't even go there! Even with the Starship Enterprise, all but the most miniscule little fraction of the Cosmos would still be far, far, far out of our reach.
Form Follows Function:
The more intelligent and capable a creative agency (inventor, artist, design team, etc.) is, the better it will be at crafting the form of an artifact to its function. If the Cosmos was designed by an omni-capable being or beings, we would expect it to suit its purpose with exquisite, sublime perfection. We certainly would not expect all but the teeniest part of it to consist of wasted space, energy, and material. We would expect that it be functional for its intended purpose for most, if not all, of its operational lifetime.
So, if this Cosmos was designed by intelligence(s), it very clearly was not designed as a human-habitat. It only barely permits our existence at all! Even if the Cosmos is a created artifact (you have provided no evidence for this claim) we have no reason to assume we could even fathom its purpose. You are like a bacterium on an office doorknob in the Large Hadron Collider complex saying, "Hey! I can live here! The Great Bacterium must have made this place just for me!
The Cosmos we live in is compelling evidence against your god.
