One question for Christians

[Esquilax]

So... now you are telling me what I know? How is it somebody with so many, many questions and "maybe's"....knows so much about what he doesn't know?

I'm not making any claim to knowledge. I'm just noting that when it's convenient for you, god is some unknowable being that sees no reason to provide information about himself, but that doesn't stop you all from making numerous declarative statements about him and his attributes. Which is it? Is he unknowable, or can he be known?

It can't be both.

Do you believe even in your wildest dreams that GOD needs to answer to you? "One day...every knee will bend and every lip profess the Lord Jesus."

That day... I cannot wait for my friend!

This has always puzzled me: do you really picture your god as that egotistical and vain that he would refuse to approach a conversation with a human with even the vaguest pretense of equality? Why would a god mind so much that I'm curious about his creation even after death?

And if this is the case, what's the deal with prayer? Why would any of you bother entreating god for anything, if he's that completely up his own ass that the very idea that one of his creations would dare to want to know more sends him into hysterics?

How do you square your god's supposed benevolence with this complete unwillingness to engage in one of the cornerstones of conversation, and how does one forge a personal relationship with him if he's unavailable for conversation by choice?

I see some glimmer of hope here my friend? If you could just ponder that one statement: "I love you so much, that I paid the price for sin." You may get the TRUE answer!

I don't care what the answer is, so long as it's the true answer. I just can't square the idea of a blood sacrifice as payment for anything, nor does anything in this scenario make sense. But then, things are often nonsensical to start with. Now, I just need actual evidence.

Its not petty BS otherwise you wouldn't be talking to me. IF you really want answers, ask! The real teacher isn't anyone you can see. Its the Holy Spirit which was sent after Jesus died, to teach ALL MEN! We are all students. There is only one teacher. Because there is only one who knows everything!

That feels a little empty. Not to mention, directly contradictory to your statement about god not needing to answer to me. Does he provide answers, or not?

"REALITY" Have we not had this conversation before?! Everything is based on Theory. Reality is even a theory, and is in the eyes of the beholder!

Not so much. There are certain things we can know to be true, assuming we discard solipsism as a useless proposition. I mean, I could be a brain in a jar, but what use is that?

And you've made persumptions about most everything [I've] said! At least I'll admit to mine!

Mine aren't personal in nature, however. There are some assumptions one can safely make, but as my sig and the post above attest, you have no compunction about doling out ad hominem attacks despite not even knowing my name. That's a far cry from deconstructing argumentation.

So, you give to a charity and that makes you what? Do you want a list of the charities I have? Or the places I've gone to volunteer, and help? No!

Of course not! And that's not the point! I'm not trying to have a holier than thou contest with you, I'm just pointing out that you're awfully quick to label me a selfish monster despite not knowing anything about me beyond the fact that I'm an atheist. One doesn't follow from the other, and I'd be awfully appreciative if you'd quit with the stereotypes. I haven't called you a pedophile for being catholic, after all.

I'm not that high on myself...nor do I feel its ever enough! And.... my purpose isn't for man's approval. "...For you have already received your reward, here on earth."

I explained my rationale in the thread. I'm not doing my work for approval, I'm doing it to share the gift of reading and writing, something I appreciate on many levels. I brought it up to show the inaccuracy of reading the word atheist under my name and calling me selfish or only concerned with me. It's just demonstrably wrong, and furthermore not really conducive to conversation, now is it?

And what praytell is the intelligent answer that you are looking for? God in the form of an Quadratic Equation? Or so grand phenomenon in the sky? All would be deemed as a trick! That's why Jesus never performed miracles as proof! NEVER!

Well, anything other than empty platitudes and appeals to faith would be a good start.

And that is why He came in humility. Because it's not about seeing with the mind...It's about seeing with the heart!

Ooh, like that!

I know what you don't have. I also know your motives. And they are not for answers. They are to tell me whats wrong with me. There are only 2 atheists that I met here that truely have open minds.

I haven't said a word about you, personally. In fact, you were the one who initiated this exchange with a lengthy ad hominem, telling me all about what you thought was wrong with me. It's why your first words to me in this thread were "hate to butt in..."

Besides, my motives here are as they've always been: to expose myself to new positions, and to deconstruct the bad ones. It's got nothing to do with you, or with christianity in general.

I like using Jesus' words! No one has a good comeback!

Preaching is generally fairly unassailable in an argument, being that it has nothing to say.

Hey I'm glad for you! I pray for you and the others every night! So, maybe God had something to do with your new job?

I think my hard work had something to do with my new job. If there's a creator god, then he deserves credit for creating a universe conducive to my achievements, not credit for each individual thing that I do.

I wouldn't brag about that muffin.... Especially if you have a little one or a dog that's not house broken!

The muffin came out fine.

Ok! I do get excited once in a while! But I'm only guilty of presumption and being rude! It rubs off from being around here too much.

I didn't hate myself when I was without God... it just sucked! thats true [for me]. My life is much better now that I have Him. And I truely wish everyone could experience His Divine Love!

It's great that you're feeling better, it just kind of bums me out that some people can't see they can have that level of happiness independent of a god. We all have that capacity in us, after all.

Seriously.... Good Luck with the new job! I hope..and pray, all works out for you!

Okay, legitimate thanks for that, that's nice.

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Not all, when one is in a relationship with Him we are able to see His truths on those things that are important to our lives.

Unless he's lying. That's the thing, a sufficiently powerful being would be able to convince you of anything, truthful or not. It's entirely possible that life is a test, just not the one you're expecting it to be, and you're failing. How would any of us know?

Add to that, the human mind is really susceptible to suggestion and trickery, and we tend to hold onto ideas really tightly, become invested in them even if they're wrong.

We do not need to know more than God, we only need to know Him and accept what was done for us. Then we have the mind that created the universe to enlighten us, so the little drab and drool that escapes from your Satan controlled mouth can not nor does not impress us in the least, a thing we learned from Job.

And if the whole thing, the entire new testament, was another, higher stakes trick? You'd be guilty of violating the first commandment by worshiping Jesus the false idol.

Mohammed has the more recent revelation from god, what if his turns out to be right, a warning from the one true god that Jesus was a false prophet? I mean, you guys accepted that Jesus came down to correct certain biblical laws, so you clearly think that it's not only possible, but plausible; what is it about these other revelations that makes them false?