What is "FAITH"

[Esquilax]

What's important is that each person excepts Christ for who He is and what He did, most of the rest are doctrinal differences that mean nothing about salvation, you do not understand what salvation is this is why you have trouble understanding us. Oh I know you can give the simple answer, however that's only words out of you mouth, not an understanding.

That's what you say, but it's hardly consensus, which is why we keep asking you, how can you prove that your definition is the right one. You've never given an answer beyond "that's what the bible says," and when we point out that other people read the same words and come to different conclusions you've never once seemed to even consider that yours might be the interpretation that's wrong. You fall back on the old personal experience gambit, conveniently ignoring that all the others are using the same damn excuse to validate their positions.

I know it will be hard, but just for a moment, imagine that you're wrong. Better yet, imagine you're looking at all this from the outside; who do I trust? Why do I trust you over anyone else? You're all claiming exactly the same thing, and using exactly the same kinds of justifications to do it; if I'm catholic the reason the protestants are wrong is because they haven't studied the scriptures correctly, if I'm protestant the reverse is offered. You claim it's all doctrinal differences, but according to some sources those doctrines are the difference between heaven and hell. For ages the catholics had this concept of limbo, where all the unbaptized babies would go, and in essence you're treating an entire extra realm of existence as nothing more than a cosmetic difference.

So I ask you again: why should I take your salvation-only doctrine as true, when if I wanted to I could find another person, even a preacher if I really looked, that would tell me with equal conviction that I'm going to hell for sleeping with dudes, christian or not?

You haven't the ability to take me on, just forget it. It was the issue at hand until you decided it wasn't.

The issue was always interpretation. I don't care about the words of the bible, just the contents of the minds of its followers. The words remain the same- though some groups add books, or subtract them...- but the individual executions can vary remarkably. And you know this: you just shake it all off as unimportant.

I have no idea what this is in response to.

You said that most differences in doctrine aren't important enough to worry about. It's my contention that absolutely anything that might affect the fate of your immortal soul is worth serious consideration.

According to the scriptures it's true, now I know you do not like to open up the book, but this time I would like to see you prove there are more ways than one into salvation, sorry but scripture is your only option on this one. We are discussing my God here so let's not get side tracked by other religions.

But it's not up to me, because I don't think any interpretation of the bible conforms to reality. But we've got you on one hand, claiming all we need is salvation. We've got, on the other extreme, the westboro baptist church, claiming almost everyone is going to hell but them. Both of you point to scripture to justify your views. There are preachers right now claiming that if you're gay, you're going to hell, christian or not, and they're using Leviticus to do it. There are others who claim that all of the old testament doesn't count anymore, because the new testament exists.

The only thing that unites you all is your reliance on scripture to back this up. And your only answer, when confronted with this question, is "I'm right, look at scripture."

I am almost certain that if I asked any one of those others, they'd say the same things.

Why do you bring up such ridiculous things, you bring these things into a conversation to side track us from the relevant so you can avoid scripture, why don't you study the Bible and we could avoid all this ridiculous tripe.

I notice you didn't answer any of the questions, though. If they're so ridiculous, if you're actually in possession of the truth, then why can't you demonstrate that?

And if you just tell me to read the bible again, I'll just start quoting from the holy Spiderman.

Personal experience is everything to God, without it we could not come into salvation through grace, then it continues, why would I not want a relationship with my Friend.

So how do you answer those that have personal experiences with god that contradict the findings of your own personal experiences?

Once again you through out rubbish that means nothing, besides I can't threaten you with hell, hell is your choice. If it was that important then it would be in scripture, God would have made sure of it. Christ spoke of avoiding hell far more than He spoke of heaven, since He knows how both are it seems important that we listen.

I've been told by others that god is so holy that the mere sinful thinking is the same as the sin itself to him. Lustful thinking is the same as adultery, according to Matthew 5:28, why wouldn't violent thoughts be the same as actual violence? And isn't threatening someone with hell the most violent fate possible?

See how I used scripture to justify a claim that you probably disagree with? See how easy that is? Why are you right and why am I wrong?