(October 9, 2013 at 10:49 am)Sword of Christ Wrote:(October 9, 2013 at 9:58 am)Esquilax Wrote: Aside from your... startling lack of honesty, you've got it backwards: agnosticism is about what you claim to know, and atheism is about what you claim to believe. That's why the etymology of the former term is gnosis, meaning knowledge, and the a- prefix, denoting a lack of.
That's exactly what I said, we're all agnostics as we don't know for certain. I am 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% certain that atheism/naturalism/materialism is wrong so I'm close enough to gnosticism as to Gods existence at least. What kind of God? I'd say loving God who does care about us and we're a part of Gods eternal community. You believe in some kind natural cycle of eternal decay and death and survival of the most fit, red in tooth and claw or whatever. I don't think humanity is quite what you would suggest it is, though certainly if you take certain events and societies in history we can be.
What makes you so sure the atheism and naturalism/materialism are wrong? And wrong how?
Quote:(October 9, 2013 at 10:15 am)Chas Wrote: OK, so your belief is based on faith.
Logic, reason, history, personal experience, evidence and a little bit of faith thrown in to hold it together. You do need a little of that but not too much as the existence of God ought to be reasonably self evident.
Please present your evidence.
The existence of gods is not self-evident.
Quote:Quote:Why are you here? To proselytize? To convert?
I'm subjecting my faith to some stone cold atheism to see if it withstands the onslaught of reason. It seems to thrive better on here than it would on a Christian forum.
How does it thrive? By your ignoring requests for evidence?
Quote:Quote:I don't have your faith, and absent evidence, you can't convince me to have it.
You're close minded then.
Someone awaiting evidence for a claim is skeptical, not closed-minded.
Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
Science is not a subject, but a method.