Pro abortion or not

[Lion IRC]

Thanks Lion! Given that it's an emotive and complex debate...

Complex? You make it sound simple.

...I consider a complex and moderate position, taking into account all the arguments is a reasonable position to take.

You havent taken ANY position.
Saying you are opposed to abortion but dont object to other people having abortions whenever they want - is NOT a position.

...As opposed to ignoring all the arguments on one side of the debate so we can paint the world in nice comforting black and white.

I didnt hear any arguments from you. Black OR white. For or against. So it seems that YOU are the one going for the beige, custom-fit, do whatever you feel is right morality.
How does that feel? Laodicean?
Nice? Comfortable? Popular?

...He holds two mutually exclusive principles in high esteem and has decide which one takes precedent is all.

And you agreed with someone who holds two mutually exclusive positions?

...I'm not especially lukewarm on this either. My wife had to have an abortion for an ectopic pregnancy in January.

Had to have....
This is not an "an emotive and complex" issue - not even for strong opponents of abortion-on-demand. Saving one life as opposed to definitely losing TWO, is a moral no-brainer.

The same medical/ethical dilemmas are faced when emergency necessity forces the separation of conjoined twins where either one possibly lives or both certainly die.

So please dont try to equate that life saving medical intervention with the elective destruction of healthy unborn babies.

...I desperately wanted the child to live, but sadly it was never to be.

I am very sorry for the loss of your unborn son.
Human life is precious. (Thats why I oppose abortion.)

...So I had to take the decision (because she was a mess of emotional anguish, pain and drugs) to terminate the pregnancy.

I would argue that the medical treatment of patients with ectopic pregnancies is a moral question of whether one or both lives can be saved.
The pro-life position would be that saving one life is better than losing two.

But that is still based on the position that BOTH OF THE LIVES YOU ARE TRYING TO SAVE ARE HUMAN BEINGS.

It is not a utilitarian question or a moral dilemma or a eugenics argument about which life is less valuable or precious.

...when we have had to read that sickening smug and self righteous "abortion is murder" slogan quite a lot. Kinda salts the wound each time I see it.

Why would that bother you? Those posters are aimed at people who support abortion on-demand as a right, not at doctors who are faced with the inevitable failure of an ectopic pregnancy as against the hope of at least saving the mothers life.

What percentage of the millions of abortions performed each year do you think are necessary to save the life of the mother?

...Interesting that you chose the word tolerance. I'd go with "respect" myself. Respect for another person's right to make their own decisions about their own bodies.

If an unborn baby is a boy, is their penis part of the mothers body?


(If you want to see hypocrisy writ-large, chat to a pro-choicer who opposes circumcision. You can abort an unborn baby but parents who circumcise their new born babies butchers.)

...So thanks for your view. Feel free to write it on a piece of paper, roll it up, shove it up you sanctimonious arse and set fire to it.

Your welcome.
I can assure you I wont hesitate to offer you my view anytime I see fit.
...since you are so big on "respecting" what other people do with their own bodies. I look forward to your ongoing "respect".

Its an interesting paradox that the supporters of abortion on-demand chant... it's a womans body, its a womans choice, mind your own business, right up until the baby is born, and then it's the taxpayers job to step up and support unmarried moms if her choice of fertility partner leaves her.