(April 14, 2014 at 10:57 am)Pickup_shonuff Wrote:(April 14, 2014 at 10:53 am)RobbyPants Wrote: As far as I can tell, you basically have to be willing to completely disregard any dissenting view point, and then it's relatively easy. I went though a several year period where I didn't believe and couldn't make myself believe. I really wanted to, but I wasn't willing to throw out observable evidence or logic. I was hoping I could come up with a framework where I could keep those thing and my belief and... predictably failed.
Similarly, we see people do stuff like join cults and drink poisoned beverages and die willingly. I think you just have to get to a point where you refuse to consider any other view point.
For a lot of people, they can find themselves in that position out of ignorance, and the well has already been poisoned before they run into a dissenting view point. So, they're already convinced of the argument's/evidence's wrongness before they encounter it.
So what's the trick for one to do this and retain their supposed affection for intellectual integrity? Is it even possible?
That depends
The most basic problem with religion is the need for a REWARD for claimed good behavior - and a Punishment for claimed bad behavior (Who gets to pick what is good and bad?)
A theist cannot just accept the idea that being good is done for its own sake - and that you do not get a reward. THere has to be something more. And in order NOT be be punished - they will do many things that a logical person would not - as criminals do. (Like attempt to pay their way - since obviously gods are not above blackmail)
For an uneducated person - or a person who was carefully indoctrinated at a very early age - the belief in the myths of religion - to them - WAS the acceptance of truth. Virtually everyone was telling them the religious side - and few were questioning the claim because THAT is not what they were taught to be true.
However - it was education - that changed everything. Once you realize that you can read and interpret these ancient myths and legends just as well as anyone else - and once you also realize that they together do not make much sense - it is hard then justify the THOUSANDS of different claims religions make.
However - for me - born a catholic -raised to be a priest - two of my fathers brothers were priests and actually having gone to a seminary for a while - - asking questions were normally responded with how to convince others of the religious point of view - but included no support for the statements for proof. Eventually someone said - read the bible - the whole bible - from page one - and then start again.
Of course - the person said that as an attack on my catholic upbringing - but instead of supporting their protestant religion - it pretty much proved that the whole thing is nonsense.
Now that most of the claims of the bible have turned out to be MYTH and LEGEND - and with the knowledge that most of the major sects of xtianity have accepted that to be the case - but that the origin of life still has to be a god - the problem is - there is no support for the claims of the religions afterwards.
And while Xtians in this group continue to claim that the christ is a historical figure - they STILL have yet to provide a single piece of evidence to prove that to be true. Yet - every year - more and more of the claims of the bible turn out to be unsupportable.
