RE: 'Drich, which of the millions of different christian denominations goes to Heaven?'
January 19, 2015 at 10:37 am
(January 18, 2015 at 11:49 pm)Ryantology (╯°◊°)╯︵ ══╬ Wrote: I've never asked you to drop the atonement bit. I've asked you to justify why you deserve it if you prove yourself to be insincere by trying so desperately to avoid thinking you have to live by all of God's laws. You really do desperately want to avoid living by these laws, and I completely understand why. They're terrible and stupid.what does sincerity have to do with following the law?
You've made that assertion several times now. Even after the fact that i point back to Mat 5:19 that tells us to obey every command in the law no matter how small. Which again includes the commands for attonement. (Here's the key you seem to be missing) Then in verse 20 Christ tells us our righteousness must exceed that of the pharrisees. The Pharrisees followed the law to the letter otherwise they would be expelled from the priesthood. So right their we know that following the law does not have to mean one is sincere about it. How do we know this? Because of all the rebukes Christ made concerning the Pharrisees 'following the law to the letter but disregaurding the spirit of the law.' Which is also why He says what he says in verse 20 about one having to exceed the righteousness of the pharrisees to enter Heaven. To the OT Jew of the day, one could not phathom how to exceed the righteousness of the Pharrisees as they could afford to live by every aspect of the law.. Which is also why Christ extended the law to include what is in one's heart. (because they lived by the law on the outside but their sincerity was not with the spirit of the law.)
Quote:But, Jesus makes it very obvious that you are expected to do so, not to earn atonement (seriously, I've never said this, so kindly stop arguing this point I've never tried to make), but to prove that your atonement is sincere. You can't fulfill the law yourself. You can't adhere to it 100%.Again, I have biblically demonstrated that sincereity has nothing to do with following the law. Sincereity has to do with admitting one is a sinner with no hope of ever earning righteousness by the law and earnestly repenting and seeking attonement through Jesus. Again, Jesus said one's righteousness had to exceed that of the Pharrisees therefore living by just the law was not enough. Because that is exactly how the pharrisees lived. a person could not live any closer to the law, and their efforts failed.
Quote:But you don't even try. And you teach others that they don't have to try, either. And you can deny neither of these things.Again no. Attonement is the crux of the Mosaic law. without it the whole law would only serve as a death warrant. As Paul points out in romans 7 The law (the does and don'ts) serves as the impossible standard that prooves us to be in sin and in need of attonement. Without this law it is impossible to know that one needs to attone for sin. So again I teach the law to those who are without it as Paul instructs. Then I teach the whole law to those looking to exceed the righteousness of the Pharrisees as Christ instructs.
Quote:Jesus is very specific on what lies in store for false Christians like you.
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
Wow, what a Completely dishonest exegetical effort. Not even in context.
If I were to teach people to ignore the law my fate would be as follows:
17 “Don’t think that I have come to destroy the Law of Moses or the teaching of the prophets. I have come not to destroy their teachings but to give full meaning to them. 18 I assure you that nothing will disappear from the law until heaven and earth are gone. The law will not lose even the smallest letter or the smallest part of a letter until it has all been done.
19 “A person should obey every command in the law, even one that does not seem important. Whoever refuses to obey any command and teaches others not to obey it will be the least important in God’s kingdom. But whoever obeys the law and teaches others to obey it will be great in God’s kingdom. 20 I tell you that you must do better than the teachers of the law and the Pharisees. If you are not more pleasing to God than they are, you will never enter God’s kingdom.
Not cool sport.[/quote]