RE: Arguments against existence of God.
July 11, 2012 at 8:19 pm
(This post was last modified: July 11, 2012 at 8:26 pm by Mystic.)
(July 11, 2012 at 8:12 pm)whateverist Wrote: It is better to simply keep the terms agnostic and atheist completely separate as they refer to two different questions. Agnostics are not necessarily weak atheists. One can be both a theist and agnostic, or atheist and agnostic.
The agnostic atheist is the one often referred to as a weak or soft atheist. A weak atheist has nothing to offer regarding why you should or shouldn't believe in gods, just that he has checked around the old psyche but hasn't found any operating in him. He isn't inclined to justify his lack of belief and mostly just wonders what all the fuss is about. The agnostic theist is that very rare creature who accepts a belief in god(s) on faith alone, without deluding himself that this constitutes knowledge.
Obviously one can also be gnostic in their belief in god(s) or equally certain that no gods exist. The gnostic atheist is what we would call a strong or hard atheist. This is the guy who will argue that gods flat out do not exist and he's pretty sure he's got the arguments to convince you (if you're not, like, totally stupid). I'm not sure what to call the gnostic theist .. a fundamentalist? (We both know some of the choicer descriptions one hears around here for such people.)
Other parameters which can inform ones label if you don't have belief in gods pertain to how little of a shit you give about the question, apatheist, and how much of an issue it is for you that the term "god" is so poorly defined, "ignosticist".
If you do have belief in gods you might prefer to call yourself a deist if you're not so sure a creator being really gives a shit how it all plays out. You might also call yourself a polytheist if you're very permissive in recognizing the divine in everything. Or you might be "woo woo" if you tend to identify with every spiritual movement you ever heard of.
By these definitions, I am a weak atheist. I won't defend the lack of belief in gods (which I don't find operating in my psyche) and I'm unaware of any good arguments for or against the existence of gods. Really I probably find more meaning and value in my agnosticism than I do my atheism. I'm ignostic but I don't use it as a conversation stopper (though perhaps I should). I still find the whole subject somewhat interesting in an anthropological sort of way, so I'm not as apatheist as some. Still I do not find the question of whether gods do or do not exist at all compelling. (Whatever.)
I agree with all that you said except that an agnostic atheist can be of the strong category as well, just as long as he doesn't claim to know, because there can also be gnostic atheism, which is not the same as strong atheism, but is necessarily strong atheism.
A weak atheist is necessarily agnostic.
But this categorization all occurs because people are using atheism and agnosticism in different ways.
But it's more accurate.
I can write the categories as follows.
Gnostic Atheists.
Agnostic Strong Atheists.
Soft Atheists.
As for a believer
Gnostic Theist.
Agnostic Theist.