How far reaching are God's powers?

[MilesAbbott81]

Your hypothesis contradicts the bible, but that's neither here nor there.

If you're going to contradict the Word of God, then you need to provide Scriptural evidence for your claim.

I've heard many preachers say that bad things are God's wake-up-call, or that God wants people to turn to Him in tragedy so that through faith, good can come out of bad.

Evil things happening to us aren't necessarily wake-up calls. God wakes us up when it's our time. Sometimes we simply need to experience the consequences of our actions. People turning to God in tragedy are probably not going to find Him. People seek God all the time when bad things happen to them, but they're missing the key to finding Him, which is repentance.

You have created a hypothesis - that God punishes for instruction.  So, bad things happen for instruction, not because the laws of the universe allow them to happen.  After all, if it is just the laws of the universe playing out, what is instructional about that (well, I guess it is instruction to better understand the universe's laws).

It's not really a hypothesis. And the laws of the universe are written by God, Who alone determines the where, when, and how of every event. That doesn't mean He is incapable of causing the laws of nature to accomplish His purposes. He is in full control.

How would you test your hypothesis?  Would you scientifically measure the sin of a group of people and correlate it to the rate of their children getting cancer?  Would you find that adultery causes natural disasters?

How silly you are to suggest that I would ever need to, or should ever feel an obligation, to test these things in a lab.

Everyone can feel regret over hurt they have caused others, or mistakes they have made that have harmed themselves.  No gods are needed for that.

Well, one wouldn't even exist, much less feel anything at all, without God's express permission and doing. You couldn't tie your shoes without His allowing you to do so.

Religious faith is always built on emotion.  Sometimes it has a source in a transformative or peak spiritual experience.  That's part of life, but it in no way validates a particular theology.

True religious faith is never built on emotion. It's built upon repentance, which is a gift from God. It's all grace.

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I think that's where all of our christian friends fail, ultimately.  Atheists aren't questioning gods, we don't believe that there are gods to question.  We're questioning people who tell us about gods.  Those same people tell us that everyone always gets everything wrong.  Meaningfully, and even morally, wrong.

It's hard to work out whether they want us to believe them, or argue against some ephemeral point they're making.  Okay, you're a human so you can't get right.  The evidence of you not getting it right stands all by itself.  Therefore you're...totally right?

I'm obviously missing some step that Miles can explain to me, because he does too possess that explanation, and can too express it.  He's done it many times..and the fact that I can't see it just proves how god cursed I am.   I can't even notice the missing numbers in the responses where he absolutely did explain any of this - which I physically can't see and am emotionally incapable of caring about.

Imagine all of the solid gold brilliance that he's splattered all over the pages that no one can see, on account of heart hardening and eye blinding.  It's a real shame.  Who the fuck did that and how can we lay hands on that asshole?

You know, TGN, you actually make a solid point.

What this ultimately comes down to is I am right and you are wrong, and we'll find out if that is so in the end. There is truly nothing that can be done on this forum to conclude this argument except to accept that.

Which I'm totally fine with. Your salvation, as I've mentioned, is none of my concern. EDIT: That's a little cold-hearted. Obviously I would prefer it if all accepted what I have to say. But it's just not my responsibility.

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This is just a bunch of garbage. The simple fact of the matter is that there is no reason for anything at all to exist without God as an explanation. Nothing has no reason to do anything, can't create anything, can't exist as anything other than nothing. To posit that the universe, which has no will or awareness, could ever exist on its own is patently ridiculous. God makes sense because He is supernatural and truly unbound by physics or math or whatever other form of science you wish to call upon. He is the only rational explanation for the existence of the universe, and anyone who claims otherwise is in denial or totally deluded.

So nothing but unevidenced assertions.

That's a bunch of garbage. The simple fact of the matter is that something has to exist. Nothing has no matter, energy, time, or space. Without time how long can true nothingness last? No time at all. To assert that nothingness could actually 'exist' is a contradiction in terms and patently ridiculous. God doesn't make sense because he is supernatural and unbound by physics or math or any form of science. He is not a rational explanation for the existence of anything, and anyone who claims otherwise is in denial or totally deluded.

In addition,  I assert that my assertions trump yours. The problem with argument by assertion is that an equal and opposite assertion can always be made.

Of course nothing could exist. What a ridiculous thing to say. It wouldn't have that name, and would have no one to quantify it, and you're right, therefore it wouldn't actually exist, but from our perspective it could exist, because it would be the opposite, or absence, of our existence.

All you've done is vomited out something you think is clever when it's actually incredibly stupid. I am very clearly saying that nothing can't create anything, that the universe did not suddenly emerge from nowhere. Since there is no plausible natural or scientific explanation as to how the universe came about, the only explanation that makes any sense is a supernatural one.

You can start spewing your God particle theories and whatnot, but I have no interest in arguing things that are self-evident, and will merely tell you, on God's authority, that you are wrong to accredit anyone but Him with the creation of the universe. If you can't believe that, not my problem.