Theists: Why do you love God?

[chi pan]

it looks like they're trying to do that now at the very bottom of the site.

[reverendjeremiah]

That's not evidence. It doesn't demonstrate the existence of god, nor prove that the formation of the universe is impossible.

so proving that a global flood happened and the survival of mankind happened through the use of an ark that was build beforehand is not proof? ok sure.
and i can just sense that people from all over are gonna come up saying i'm stupid for this post but i would perfer if you would instead come up with rational explinations. that's much more decent

All you did was present evidence that the flood of Gilgamesh might be true, which outdates the myth of Noah and many scholars agree that the story of Noah was more than likely stolen from the Epic of Gilgamesh.


It is NOT evidence of Noahs Arc because of many reasons.

#1 - The bible specifically speaks of God opening the "windows of heaven" to let the rain come down. The sky is not solid, not does it have windows, therefore the noah flood didnt happen

#2 - The bible spoke of the sky as a "firmament" . this meant that God himself was speaking of the sky as if it were solid. the sky is not solid, therefore the Noah flood didnt happen.

#3 - Did they find a giants footprint at the site? If not then it is Gilgamesh's boat and NOT noah's Arc. Og the giant personally travelled with Noah, riding on top of the arc and helping to steer it with his feet. No giant tracks, no Noah's ark.

#4 - Noah's arc was supposed to be the size of a football field, with one single largish door, and a single 3 foot by 3 foot window. Science says many things about its construction: It would have sank. The animals on board would have suffocated, And no animals from the Americas, Japan, Greenlad, and Australia would have EVER survived if the story was true. It is an obvious myth.

[Ace Otana]

it looks like they're trying to do that now at the very bottom of the site.

I can't wait to see the epic fail.

I hope they're using the same technology and material that was used back then, to make it as realistic and historic as possible.

The largest wooden ships in history were more modern and somewhat smaller--the odds are that the technology of the time and the reputed material (gopher wood or shittim wood = ?acacia) would have made such a structure very flimsy

[reverendjeremiah]

according to the bible the ark was 300 cubits (450 feet) long, 50 cubits (75 feet) wide, and 30 cubits (45 feet) high. as long as they can make it thick enough and watertight, i don't see any reason why it won't float.

Demonstrate it. Go build one 450 feet long and we'll see if it floats. The HMS Orlando and Mersey had to be scrapped. The hull couldn't support the ship and they were 355 feet long. So...good luck with the 450 ft!

I'll bet all my savings that the hull will buckle and give way.

Once he fails..all he has to do is say "God blessed noah's arc...this is nothing more than proof that Noah could not have done it, therefore requiring a miracle from god. Noah's arc is proof that god exists".

These people cant change unless they want to change.

[chi pan]

All you did was present evidence that the flood of Gilgamesh might be true

no, you are speaking of a different flood. more than one religion claims to have a global flood, Gilgamesh was of a poem in Mesopotamia. in that one the boat was cube shaped so it could not float.

The bible specifically speaks of God opening the "windows of heaven" to let the rain come down. The sky is not solid, not does it have windows, therefore the noah flood didnt happen

obviously it's not literal windows, it was just water above the earth coming down. as it says on the second day in the first chapter of Genesis.

The bible spoke of the sky as a "firmament" . this meant that God himself was speaking of the sky as if it were solid. the sky is not solid, therefore the Noah flood didnt happen.

is that so? does firmanent mean solid? wikipedia calls it "the vault or expanse of the sky." where does it say solid?

most everything else you say don't have any basis to them.

[Soyouz]

Chipan,

1. How old are you?
2. Have you ever been to school?

[chi pan]

why are those things relevant Soyouz? we're debating, not asking for personal information

[Erinome]

Personally, if I wanted people to take me seriously as a theist, I would not try to argue about Noah's ark. It's been debunked a million times, and even the Catholics admit that it's not a literally true story in the biblical sense.

http://bustedhalo.com/questionbox/do-cat...tual-event

Arguing that it is literally true is a bit like arguing that the grass is red. It's just stupid and kinda pathetic.

[Ace Otana]

why are those things relevant Soyouz? we're debating, not asking for personal information

Because your level of education is expected from that of someone who has not yet been to high school. In other words, you must be far behind your age if you are an adult.

[reverendjeremiah]

no, you are speaking of a different flood. more than one religion claims to have a global flood,

Oh, Im sorry...which mythical world flood were we discussing?

Gilgamesh was of a poem in Mesopotamia.

A poem? Would you care to disprove that Gilgamesh, Enlil and Enki are nothing more than poetry. Enlil is the God of breath. To claim he is nothing more than poetry is to claim that humans do not breath. If you wish to deny Enlil then why not just stop breathing then!?

in that one the boat was cube shaped so it could not float.

It could not float through your ignorance. Thankfully the boat wasnt manufacture quite exactly the way you suggest. Utnapishtum was much more intelligent than that...and your ignorance of it is not an excuse for your blasphemous tone of calling it a "poem"
Building and launching the boat
Carpenters, reed workers, and other people assembled one morning.
[missing lines]
Five days later, Utnapishtim laid out the exterior walls of the boat of 120 cubits.
The sides of the superstructure had equal lengths of 120 cubits. He also made a drawing of the interior structure.
The boat had six decks [?] divided into seven and nine compartments.
Water plugs were driven into the middle part.
Punting poles and other necessary things were laid in.
Three times 3,600 units of raw bitumen were melted in a kiln and three times 3,600 units of oil were used in addition to two times 3,600 units of oil that were stored in the boat.
Oxen and sheep were slaughtered and ale, beer, oil, and wine were distributed to the workmen, like at a new year's festival.
When the boat was finished, the launching was very difficult. A runway of poles was used to slide the boat into the water.
Two-thirds of the boat were in the water.
Utnapishtim loaded his silver and gold into the boat.
He loaded "all the living beings that I had."
His relatives and craftsmen, and "all the beasts and animals of the field" boarded the boat.
The time arrived, as stated by the god Shamash, to seal the entry door.

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So, as you can see, Utnapishtums boat is more than capable of floating...unlike the airless deathtrap that the mythological Noah supposedly made in the fable of genesis.

obviously it's not literal windows,

This is GREAT! Thanks for saying it wasnt literal. now every single mythology in the world can be argued to be correct because of this. The Earth isnt literally made out of Tiamats carcass, torn asunder by Marduk. Obviously its not literal, but it is historically accurate. The Satanic bible says that Satan created the universe. Of course its not literal, but it is still historically accurate and should be taught as serious as possible. Of course jesus didnt literally die on the cross. They just made it up for a good story and in reality Jesus fled to Gaul (modern day France) becuase he feared his death at the hands of the romans. Zeus didnt single handedly defeat the titans. He more than likely had an army of modern warfare machinery. Tanks, nuclear bombs, etc... to help him drive back the titans into Tartarus. This should be taught literally in schools.

it was just water above the earth coming down.

Hey...its your book of myths..not mine.

is that so? does firmanent mean solid? wikipedia calls it "the vault or expanse of the sky." where does it say solid?

most everything else you say don't have any basis to them.

Your reading and retention skills are lacking. Im not suprised though, as you are not very bright if you think Noahs arc was a historical event. I went over to wikipedia "firmament" and the first three paragraphs equated it with "Firm" (meaning solid) and this:

The word "firmament" is meant to correspond with the word raqia, or raqiya` ( רקיע), as used in Biblical Hebrew.
Firmamentum was used in the Vulgate, a 4th century Latin translation of the Christian bible. This term was consistent with the previous (circa 200 BC) Septuagint translation of the Old Testament which used the Greek stereoma, meaning solid structure, and with the notion of solidity advanced explicitly by other biblical passages.[4]
The original word raqia is derived from the root raqa ( רקע), meaning "to beat or spread out", e.g., the process of making a dish by hammering thin a lump of metal.[3][5] Raqa adopted the meaning "to make firm or solid" in Syriac, a major dialect of Aramaic (the vernacular of Jesus) and close cognate of Hebrew.[3] Language experts consider that the most accurate English translation for raqia in biblical Hebrew is "expanse" (i.e., that which was stretched out) and that "firmament" is a mistranslation (due to confusion with Syriac).[3] Among modern translations, NIV and ESV use the word "expanse", while the NRSV uses "dome".
The choice of translation is controversial because it affects how prominent the discord with modern cosmology first appears. It is argued that liberal Christians (and nonbelievers) are biased toward accepting a translation that favours critical and nonliteral interpretation (e.g., "firmament") whilst conservatives and fundamentalists seek a translation by which the scripture may harmonise with scientific knowledge (e.g., "expanse" implying empty sky).[6]

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Since you left that out, I will use that as evidence that you are untrustworthy, and willing to lie and edit information to suit your goals. Im not suprised though, as most Christians do the same thing. Never turn your back on them and never trust them with gathering information.