Morality: Where do you get yours?

[simplexity]

To answer your question I get it from the patterns I sense around me. It is something that I experience. Empathy, how we are all so similar, everything, nothing to do with "god" as you define him.

[Xyster]

I got mine at the bottom of a crackerJack box.

[kılıç_mehmet]

Our customs and laws are the product of more than a thousand years of testing. They are there for a reason, and they put out guidelines for a morally clean and harmonious Turkish society.

Yeah, the reason being blind and uncritical obedience. Slavery was around for thousands of years as well. That didn't make it right.

Slavery is still around, friend, you just don't notice it. I can tell you that being a conscious slave with a master who whips you is certainly much better than the unconscious slavery you and me are subject today, even without feeling it's whip.
The conscious slave dreams of overthrowing his oppressor. The unconscious slave strives to please his oppressor.

And I would not advocate these values if I did not come to this conclusion that they were not best for our people. I advocate our own values. Not anyone elses.

[genkaus]

Slavery is still around, friend, you just don't notice it. I can tell you that being a conscious slave with a master who whips you is certainly much better than the unconscious slavery you and me are subject today, even without feeling it's whip.
The conscious slave dreams of overthrowing his oppressor. The unconscious slave strives to please his oppressor.

Really? Examples please.

And I would not advocate these values if I did not come to this conclusion that they were not best for our people. I advocate our own values. Not anyone elses.

And what if they don't agree? Too damn bad, huh?

[kılıç_mehmet]

Really? Examples please.

How about the workers in china? They certainly have no obligations to work for anyone by whip. But they have to. And they have to comply with whatever salary their master deems appropriate for them.

And what if they don't agree? Too damn bad, huh?

If they didn't, these values would not exist today.
But they do, just as I do. If they ceased to exist, so would we. We'd simply be absorbed by some other people who is able to hold on to it's own values.

[Gooders1002]

I get my morality from this 6 words: 'try not to be a cunt' and its worked out pretty well so far.

[jess_essential]

Morality is different for everyone, I have no moral compass guiding me anywhere. I treat people how I want to be treated. I agree with Moshrun, completely.

[genkaus]

How about the workers in china? They certainly have no obligations to work for anyone by whip. But they have to. And they have to comply with whatever salary their master deems appropriate for them.

So, they've no obligation to work, they get a salary for the work and they are not treated as property. Doesn't sound like slavery to me.

[quote='kılıç_mehmet' pid='284463' dateline='1336740047']If they didn't, these values would not exist today.

No, as indicated, values can be forced onto others, which would lead to its survival.

[quote='kılıç_mehmet' pid='284463' dateline='1336740047']But they do, just as I do. If they ceased to exist, so would we. We'd simply be absorbed by some other people who is able to hold on to it's own values.

So, to eliminate any threat to your society's identity, you force your values on anyone who wouldn't willingly accept them?

[jess_essential]

For anyone to follow any type of list of rules made by anyone, other than yourself, is foolish. I will not say that I have morals, because humans are morally bankrupt. However, as I've said, I treat people well because I would like to be treated well. And when I am not being treated well, I act accordingly.

[Creed of Heresy]

Golden rule? Fuck that nonsense.

My dad wouldn't like you to call him beautiful during sex, would hate you nibbling on his neck, and definitely does not want your dick in him...

I, on the other hand, would be having the time of my life.

So I don't do to other people what I'd like done to me.

I also do not want you to beat me into the ground and call me a dirty whore. But someone does. I don't want a horse to fuck me, but someone does.

...

Point: you can't base your interaction with other people solely off of what you yourself would appreciate being done (or not being done) to you.

What a selfish and egocentric worldview.

Of course you can. You imply that it has to be a universal constant that if you want it, therefore you should do it. But I mean...I highly doubt you want to sleep with your father. Therefore that entire analogy holds no bearing because none of those actions would happen anyway.

See, you would be having the time of your life...but would you be having the time of your life if that individual was your father? Apply the golden rule at THAT point, the point of sleeping with your father, not the latter point, and that argument becomes needless.

...Which begs the question. Would you WANT your father to sleep with you? Even if the answer is "Yes," the question then becomes "would your father want to sleep with you?" If yes...

...well...have fun with that...I guess? o___o

But if no...if either side says "no," then it becomes a matter of rape, of lack of consent. And then THAT, too, ties to the Golden Rule; would you want someone to do something against your will? I HIGHLY doubt it. Ergo, do not go against their will.

The Golden Rule is not about picking and choosing. It is an aspect of ALL decisions. It sounds simple. But in practice, not so much. Egocentric and selfish? Not even slightly.

---

For anyone to follow any type of list of rules made by anyone, other than yourself, is foolish. I will not say that I have morals, because humans are morally bankrupt. However, as I've said, I treat people well because I would like to be treated well. And when I am not being treated well, I act accordingly.

I would argue against humans being morally bankrupt, actually, if only because we have nothing else to compare it to. We've yet to encounter aliens, or any other fully sapient race, that we can compare our own moral codes against. Morality is ultimately a measure of knowing right from wrong and given that I can walk down the street and see every human being I come across NOT assaulting one another or stealing shit from one another points to most humans being of at least decent moral standing, if not high moral standing. I also understand that human beings do have a selfish basis in everything, but is that wrong? No. Selfishness is inevitable in everything we do, even if pursuit of self-satisfaction is not the goal, we are still given it in some way no matter what. Selfishness is not bad; it's when you are selfish at the malign, intended cost of others around you that it is bad and therefore immoral.