Does the Bible Contradict Itself?

[ElDinero]

Not sure I understand. Augustus lived until 19 August, AD 14, so Herod was alive during the Emperor's census.

Min already explained it in his original post. Quirinus was made governor in 6AD and Herod died in 4BC. Therefore it couldn't have taken place while both were in power, as those times were mutually exclusive.

[spockrates]

[Undeceived]

How is knowing someone's decision the same as deciding for them?

Your God created me knowing that I would make the decision to deny him, his son, and the ever elusive holy ghost. God knew my punishment and knew my future decisions, but created me anyway. Where exactly was my choice in this scheme?

You say he knew your "decisions". That sounds like a choice to me. Keep this argument on an individual basis. You are not one in a slushpile of social security numbers. There is no other version of you who would choose differently. You are you, God made you, and you make your choice. God did decide the number of people who would ultimately accept or reject him, but he did not decide individually for each person. There's a difference. One is the individual. One is humanity. Humanity did not have free will to determine which individuals make it up--I suppose that is your argument.
Now the question why he chose so many to disbelieve is not ours to answer. Perhaps he created only as far as personalities, letting them run their own course. Perhaps position in life helps determine the choice--in which case it would be impossible to have all believers because there would always be that poor child with neglectful parents. The problem in speculating why is that we do not entirely know what leads a person to choose God or accept him. What are the factors? Is it personality? Social standing? God's sovereign choice? The latter is strongest. Romans 9:19-21:

It does not, therefore, depend on human desire or effort, but on God’s mercy. For Scripture says to Pharaoh: “I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.
One of you will say to me: “Then why does God still blame us? For who is able to resist his will?” But who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? “Shall what is formed say to the one who formed it, ‘Why did you make me like this?’” Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for special purposes and some for common use?

You might read into the verse and think, "Why shall I try if God has condemned me already?" But in reality you would not believe he has condemned you because you do not believe he exists. If you believed he exists, you would be one of those pottery "for special purposes". And maybe you will be. The moment you believe the verse is the moment you become one of his elect.

[Taqiyya Mockingbird]

[ElDinero]

The census would likely have taken several years to complete. Why could it not have taken place during the reign of both governors--beginning with one and ending with the other?

What's your basis for saying that it would have taken over ten years? Bearing in mind that ten years is the absolute MINIMUM amount of time, if it started just as Herod was about to cark it and ended just as Quirinus came into office.

This strikes at the heart of why people have been reluctant to participate in your thread. You're given an example and instead of thinking about it as a problem, you stick with your original position no matter what and try to find ways to shoehorn it any way you can, making unsupported assertions along the way.

[spockrates]

I changed my mind after realizing there are more than vicious knids at this forum!

[ElDinero]

Let's try a simple one. Who begat Salah?

[spockrates]

The census would likely have taken several years to complete. Why could it not have taken place during the reign of both governors--beginning with one and ending with the other?

What's your basis for saying that it would have taken over ten years? Bearing in mind that ten years is the absolute MINIMUM amount of time, if it started just as Herod was about to cark it and ended just as Quirinus came into office.

This strikes at the heart of why people have been reluctant to participate in your thread. You're given an example and instead of thinking about it as a problem, you stick with your original position no matter what and try to find ways to shoehorn it any way you can, making unsupported assertions along the way.

It would take much time to have everyone in ancient Palestine (men and women) journey to the village or city in which their ancestors were born. The ancient world moved by a slower clock than our world does. We would need some documentation indicating when the census began and when it ended, or some indication of how long each person had to comply. It might have taken place in stages--one tribe of Israel every few years, or one area every few years. Making everyone move at the same time would stop the economy (and taxes paid to Rome). It would defeat the purpose of doing a census--which was to increase the money coming from the Roman occupied territory.

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Let's try a simple one. Who begat Salah?

Please be more specific.

[ElDinero]

It would take much time to have everyone in ancient Palestine (men and women) journey to the village or city in which their ancestors were born. The ancient world moved by a slower clock than our world does. We would need some documentation indicating when the census began and when it ended, or some indication of how long each person had to comply. It might have taken place in stages--one tribe of Israel every few years, or one area every few years. Making everyone move at the same time would stop the economy (and taxes paid to Rome). It would defeat the purpose of doing a census--which was to increase the money coming from the Roman occupied territory.

Look, just because it took the Jews forty years to complete a journey that should have taken six weeks, just how much slower was this fucking ancient clock? Like I said, unsupported assertions. You can't back up any of the above, it's pure conjecture.

With regards Salah, I don't see what's causing you the problem. There is a character named Salah. I want to know who his father was.

[Undeceived]