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Why must Christian apologists tell lies?
#71
RE: Why must Christian apologists tell lies?
(September 5, 2012 at 8:13 am)LastPoet Wrote: Ah, Poe's Law Big Grin

I resemble that remark
"You don't need facts when you got Jesus." -Pastor Deacon Fred, Landover Baptist Church

™: True Christian is a Trademark of the Landover Baptist Church. I have no affiliation with this fine group of True Christians ™ because I can't afford their tithing requirements but would like to be. Maybe someday the Lord will bless me with enough riches that I am able to. 

And for the lovers of Poe, here's your winking smiley:  Wink
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#72
RE: Why must Christian apologists tell lies?
I think one reason you might see apologists lie, or keep relying on debunked information or arguments, is because the apologists themselves were never convinced in their faith by their own arguments. Craig for instance, has written about having a religious experience in coming to his faith. Apparently his "logical" arguments, the sort they he expects you to be convinced by, is not what convinced himself. He seems to be completely convinced by his experience alone. Craig was once asked if he were to travel back in time to when Jesus was supposed to have been resurrected and found that he never rose, Craig replied that he would have assumed that it was trick because he "knows" Jesus rose by the "work of the holy spirit in his life." That's how delusional he is. You could give him the best evidence you could possible get, and he wouldn't except it.

I suspect that many apologists are like Craig in this respect and given that they were convinced by experience rather than reason, they think that their arguments no matter how flawed must be closer to the truth than an atheist's argument so they keep using them. And you have to realize that ultimately, in these debates, they're not there to convince the person they're debating. They're only there to "win souls" in the audience. And if their arguments "win souls" it doesn't really matter how bad their arguments are. Apologists are evangelistic utilitarians.
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"The lord doesn't work in mysterious ways, but in ways that are indistinguishable from his nonexistence."
-- George Yorgo Veenhuyzen quoted by John W. Loftus in The End of Christianity (p. 103).
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#73
RE: Why must Christian apologists tell lies?
(September 5, 2012 at 12:42 pm)teaearlgreyhot Wrote: I think one reason you might see apologists lie, or keep relying on debunked information or arguments, is because the apologists themselves were never convinced in their faith by their own arguments. Craig for instance, has written about having a religious experience in coming to his faith. Apparently his "logical" arguments, the sort they he expects you to be convinced by, is not what convinced himself. He seems to be completely convinced by his experience alone. Craig was once asked if he were to travel back in time to when Jesus was supposed to have been resurrected and found that he never rose, Craig replied that he would have assumed that it was trick because he "knows" Jesus rose by the "work of the holy spirit in his life." That's how delusional he is. You could give him the best evidence you could possible get, and he wouldn't except it.

I suspect that many apologists are like Craig in this respect and given that they were convinced by experience rather than reason, they think that their arguments no matter how flawed must be closer to the truth than an atheist's argument so they keep using them. And you have to realize that ultimately, in these debates, they're not there to convince the person they're debating. They're only there to "win souls" in the audience. And if their arguments "win souls" it doesn't really matter how bad their arguments are. Apologists are evangelistic utilitarians.

You got me thinking, I am coming to think Christian Apologetics in the form William Lane Craig is famous for, is basically an attempt appear to be rational to the "infidels". Also that is approach to tell people why you believe the tenets of Christianity is true, rather than stating the truth that the "holy spirit just worked through me" is fundamentally dishonest.
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