Failed Biblical Prophecies

[Tea Earl Grey Hot]

It's amazing how much Christians will stretch prophecy to make it "true."

[Minimalist]

You will be sought, but you will never again be found, declares the Sovereign LORD

Whoops, drippy. THERE it is. I found it...and so will anyone who fucking bothers looking.

Get your head out of your ass, son. You may pull this shit with other fundie morons but you will not get away with it here.

[Simon Moon]

Look at your picture a little more closly minnie. To me it seems like God's word is being proved here. For in the Foreground we see the ruins of the 'city' in which Ezekial spoke. It remains desolate. God did not curse the ground of tyre where no one could ever dewell on the grounds ever again (like He did with Eden or Sodom and Gormorrah.) He cursed the actual city and the people who lived there. Again it looks to me by your own pic that no one of that time is left alive nor is their anyone living in the orginal city ezk spoke of. So what part of the phophesy tickles your fancy so?

Seriously? You don't really think that the ruins you see in the foreground were the entire city of ancient Tyre?

Modern Tyre was built over much of the ruins of ancient Tyre. So still the prophecy fails.

[Drich]

So what you're saying is that god had already promised the Jebusites protection? Then why did he say they would conquer the Jebusites? And why does the second passage say "Judah could not dislodge the Jebusites", as in it was impossible, rather than that he didn't try?

The jubusites and the hitites were essentially the same people (just a different region.) The hitites were destroyed completely. The Jubusites were conquored, just not wiped from exsistance. Just like when Rome occupied Jureslem during the time of Christ. The Jews were a conqured people even though they still occupied the land. In the case of the Jubusites the Jews occupied their former lands. making the tribes of juda and benjamin the conquors, and the Jubusites the conquored.

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Joshua 3:7-10 And the Lord said to Joshua, “Today I will begin to exalt you in the eyes of all Israel, so they may know that I am with you as I was with Moses. 8 Tell the priests who carry the ark of the covenant: ‘When you reach the edge of the Jordan’s waters, go and stand in the river.’”

9 Joshua said to the Israelites, “Come here and listen to the words of the Lord your God. 10 This is how you will know that the living God is among you and that he will certainly drive out before you the Canaanites, Hittites, Hivites, Perizzites, Girgashites, Amorites and Jebusites.

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Joshua 15:63 Judah could not dislodge the Jebusites, who were living in Jerusalem; to this day the Jebusites live there with the people of Judah.

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Here, god states "Today I will begin to exalt you in the eyes of all Israel, so they may know that I am with you as I was with Moses." In other words, god is with him. Then god says "This is how you will know that the living God is among you and that he will certainly drive out before you the Canaanites, Hittites, Hivites, Perizzites, Girgashites, Amorites and Jebusites." Therefore, if god is with them, these peoples will be driven out. But then it goes on to say "Judah could not dislodge the Jebusites, who were living in Jerusalem; to this day the Jebusites live there with the people of Judah." There are only three possibilites: god lied to him and was not with him; god was incapable of stopping the Jebusites; or this is a biblical contradiction.

Well, we can rule out god's failure as he is omnipotent and could not possibly fail at anything. As for god's lying:

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Hebrews 6:18 18 God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope set before us may be greatly encouraged.

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and

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Numbers 23:19-20 19 God is not human, that he should lie,
not a human being, that he should change his mind.
Does he speak and then not act?
Does he promise and not fulfill?
20 I have received a command to bless;
he has blessed, and I cannot change it.

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So god lying is out of the question. Therefore, the only remaining choice is that this is a contradiction.

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Wait, I remember now (thanks to our resident poe):

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Judges 1:19 19 The Lord was with the men of Judah. They took possession of the hill country, but they were unable to drive the people from the plains, because they had chariots fitted with iron.

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Here is the answer: god couldn't win because of iron chariots...
Yeah, I don't get it either.
You might object that it says Judah, and not Joshua, but the promise was extended to Judah in the below passage.

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Judges 1:1-2 After the death of Joshua, the Israelites asked the Lord, “Who of us is to go up first to fight against the Canaanites?”

2 The Lord answered, “Judah shall go up; I have given the land into their hands.”

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Nonetheless, it says the lord was with them, and in the early passage it says he will show he is with them by allowing them to conquer such and such kingdoms, including the Jebusites, who they failed to defeat.

So, it looks like god is a little less than all-powerful today. But, the apologist will say, god is not necessarily omnipotent. (At least s/he will say this if s/he wishes to avoid the contradiction, but that would bring up other problems.)

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Matt 19:26 Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

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Therefore god is omnipotent, therefore all things, including the defeat of iron chariots, are possible with god. However, it says "but they were unable to drive the people from the plains, because they had chariots fitted with iron." Unable as in couldn't do it. But, "The Lord was with the men of Judah." and "This is how you will know that the living God is among you and that he will certainly drive out before you the Canaanites, Hittites, Hivites, Perizzites, Girgashites, Amorites and Jebusites." Key word certainly.
I don't know how even an apologist could weasel their way out of this one, but they never cease to appaul disgust annoy...amaze me.

Just because "God is with someone" does not mean they use what is avaiable to them. Look at yourself. You have the same oppertunity to tap into God's resources as I do, and you have chosen not to. Does that mean God so loved me that He gave his only begotten Son, that if I believe I should not persih, and disregaurd you??? No of course not! You do not have access to God because you do not have faith in God even though God has faith enough in you to John 3:16

People do this all the time. We have access to God but do not take advantage of what has been offered. Can God be stopped by 'iron charriots?" No of course not. but the Judeans who fought this battle most certaintly could if they did not have faith in God. They like you simply saw the 'proof' of the opposition and followed the evidence off of the battle field. Then blamed God for their 'faith.'

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You will be sought, but you will never again be found, declares the Sovereign LORD

Whoops, drippy. THERE it is. I found it...and so will anyone who fucking bothers looking.

Get your head out of your ass, son. You may pull this shit with other fundie morons but you will not get away with it here.

Again minnie,

Who was ezk/god talking to? The people who live in a given place at a given time or the physical earth these people lived on? As I see it non of these people have been found, that God made good on what He promised.

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Look at your picture a little more closly minnie. To me it seems like God's word is being proved here. For in the Foreground we see the ruins of the 'city' in which Ezekial spoke. It remains desolate. God did not curse the ground of tyre where no one could ever dewell on the grounds ever again (like He did with Eden or Sodom and Gormorrah.) He cursed the actual city and the people who lived there. Again it looks to me by your own pic that no one of that time is left alive nor is their anyone living in the orginal city ezk spoke of. So what part of the phophesy tickles your fancy so?

Seriously? You don't really think that the ruins you see in the foreground were the entire city of ancient Tyre?

Modern Tyre was built over much of the ruins of ancient Tyre. So still the prophecy fails.

To you too. Did God condemn a given people and a given city who existed in a given time or did God condemn the earth for hosting this city and these people? God did not condemn the ground. He destroyed a people and a place. None of the buildings nor any of the greatness ascribed to these orginal people are left.

What fails is your understanding of what is being discussed here. God did not destroy the earth for hosting these people as he did with sodom and gomorrah, or eden. God cursed a people, a culture and what they produced.

[Darkstar]

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So what you're saying is that god had already promised the Jebusites protection? Then why did he say they would conquer the Jebusites? And why does the second passage say "Judah could not dislodge the Jebusites", as in it was impossible, rather than that he didn't try?

The jubusites and the hitites were essentially the same people (just a different region.) The hitites were destroyed completely. The Jubusites were conquored, just not wiped from exsistance. Just like when Rome occupied Jureslem during the time of Christ. The Jews were a conqured people even though they still occupied the land. In the case of the Jubusites the Jews occupied their former lands. making the tribes of juda and benjamin the conquors, and the Jubusites the conquored.

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Le sigh. Let's look at what was actually written, shall we?

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Joshua 3:7-10 And the Lord said to Joshua, “Today I will begin to exalt you in the eyes of all Israel, so they may know that I am with you as I was with Moses. 8 Tell the priests who carry the ark of the covenant: ‘When you reach the edge of the Jordan’s waters, go and stand in the river.’”

9 Joshua said to the Israelites, “Come here and listen to the words of the Lord your God. 10 This is how you will know that the living God is among you and that he will certainly drive out before you the Canaanites, Hittites, Hivites, Perizzites, Girgashites, Amorites and Jebusites.

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Note the bolded. They were not to simply be conquered, but driven out. That means if they still occupied the land, this would be untrue.

---

Joshua 15:63 Judah could not dislodge the Jebusites, who were living in Jerusalem; to this day the Jebusites live there with the people of Judah.

---

Lo and behold, they weren't driven out.

---

Wait, I remember now (thanks to our resident poe):

---

Judges 1:19 19 The Lord was with the men of Judah. They took possession of the hill country, but they were unable to drive the people from the plains, because they had chariots fitted with iron.

---

Here is the answer: god couldn't win because of iron chariots...
Yeah, I don't get it either.
You might object that it says Judah, and not Joshua, but the promise was extended to Judah in the below passage.

---

Judges 1:1-2 After the death of Joshua, the Israelites asked the Lord, “Who of us is to go up first to fight against the Canaanites?”

2 The Lord answered, “Judah shall go up; I have given the land into their hands.”

---

Nonetheless, it says the lord was with them, and in the early passage it says he will show he is with them by allowing them to conquer such and such kingdoms, including the Jebusites, who they failed to defeat.

So, it looks like god is a little less than all-powerful today. But, the apologist will say, god is not necessarily omnipotent. (At least s/he will say this if s/he wishes to avoid the contradiction, but that would bring up other problems.)

---

Matt 19:26 Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

---

Therefore god is omnipotent, therefore all things, including the defeat of iron chariots, are possible with god. However, it says "but they were unable to drive the people from the plains, because they had chariots fitted with iron." Unable as in couldn't do it. But, "The Lord was with the men of Judah." and "This is how you will know that the living God is among you and that he will certainly drive out before you the Canaanites, Hittites, Hivites, Perizzites, Girgashites, Amorites and Jebusites." Key word certainly.
I don't know how even an apologist could weasel their way out of this one, but they never cease to appaul disgust annoy...amaze me.

Just because "God is with someone" does not mean they use what is avaiable to them. Look at yourself. You have the same oppertunity to tap into God's resources as I do, and you have chosen not to. Does that mean God so loved me that He gave his only begotten Son, that if I believe I should not persih, and disregaurd you??? No of course not! You do not have access to God because you do not have faith in God even though God has faith enough in you to John 3:16

People do this all the time. We have access to God but do not take advantage of what has been offered. Can God be stopped by 'iron charriots?" No of course not. but the Judeans who fought this battle most certaintly could if they did not have faith in God. They like you simply saw the 'proof' of the opposition and followed the evidence off of the battle field. Then blamed God for their 'faith.'

---

"Just because "God is with someone" does not mean they use what is avaiable to them." Really? Let's again look at the actual text.

---

"This is how you will know that the living God is among you and that he will certainly drive out before you the Canaanites, Hittites, Hivites, Perizzites, Girgashites, Amorites and Jebusites."

---

Here god says he will certainly drive all of those people out to show that he is with him. Judah need not 'use' god, god had already said he would do it of his own accord.

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Whoops, drippy. THERE it is. I found it...and so will anyone who fucking bothers looking.

Get your head out of your ass, son. You may pull this shit with other fundie morons but you will not get away with it here.

Again minnie,

Who was ezk/god talking to? The people who live in a given place at a given time or the physical earth these people lived on? As I see it non of these people have been found, that God made good on what He promised.

---

It's an ancient city, of course it is going to crumble eventually. The new city was built over the ancient ruins of the old one. Tell me, how many ancient cities still exist in their original states, and how many of those that do not would you say were permanantly destroyed by god. Note "never found again". Uh, it's right there.

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Seriously? You don't really think that the ruins you see in the foreground were the entire city of ancient Tyre?

Modern Tyre was built over much of the ruins of ancient Tyre. So still the prophecy fails.

To you too. Did God condemn a given people and a given city who existed in a given time or did God condemn the earth for hosting this city and these people? God did not condemn the ground. He destroyed a people and a place. None of the buildings nor any of the greatness ascribed to these orginal people are left.

What fails is your understanding of what is being discussed here. God did not destroy the earth for hosting these people as he did with sodom and gomorrah, or eden. God cursed a people, a culture and what they produced.

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Where were Sodom and Gomorrah anyway? Likewise, what reason do you have to believe that god cursed them when virtually every ancient culture disappeared long ago?

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Over time, he leveled up and got more and more powerful as a god until finally becoming omnipotent in the NT.

Revelation 19:6 The Lord God omnipotent reigneth.

I guess omnipotence is something you get as a 20th level god.

Ha ha, I get it now! God isn't sadistic, just greedy! He didn't kill all of those people in the OT because he was angry; he killed them for the experience points!

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I actually made this one myself. Well, edited an existing image, anyway.

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[YahwehIsTheWay]

Darkstar, the problem is you and Min are reading the Bible with your sinful eyes.

You need to read the Bible as Drich does, with the Holy Spirit. You can read a lot more that way (or less, depending on what's needed).

Now, you may be saying, "but Yah-way, I see no reason to believe in the Holy Spirit". That's because you're looking for it only with those five senses. You have to look for it with the Holy Spirit.

[Darkstar]

Now, you may be saying, "but Yah-way, I see no reason to believe in the Holy Spirit".

Yah-way? Thus prompting this:

[Ryantology]

Darkstar, the problem is you and Min are reading the Bible with your sinful eyes.

You need to read the Bible as Drich does, with the Holy Spirit. You can read a lot more that way (or less, depending on what's needed).

Now, you may be saying, "but Yah-way, I see no reason to believe in the Holy Spirit". That's because you're looking for it only with those five senses. You have to look for it with the Holy Spirit.

You need to listen to Johnny Cash read it.

<3

[Minimalist]

Darkstar, the problem is you and Min are reading the Bible with your sinful eyes.

Fuck the fucking bible, Yourway. I'm looking at a fucking photo of modern fucking Tyre after his fucking god said no one would ever fucking find it again and I fucking found it.

Fuck, exekiel and the rest of those phony con men.

The present-day city of Tyre covers a large part of the original island and has expanded onto and covers most of the causeway, which had increased greatly in width over the centuries because of extensive silt depositions on either side. The part of the original island that is not covered by the modern city of Tyre consists mostly of an archaeological site showcasing remains of the city from ancient times.

Wiki.


I mean we can argue about a lot of things but the FUCKING CITY IS STILL THERE. At some point Drippy is going to have to face FACTS and understand that his fucking bible is fucking bullshit!

[Drich]

Note the bolded. They were not to simply be conquered, but driven out. That means if they still occupied the land, this would be untrue.

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Joshua 15:63 Judah could not dislodge the Jebusites, who were living in Jerusalem; to this day the Jebusites live there with the people of Judah.

---

Lo and behold, they weren't driven out.

Oh I see what you mean! I guess your right they weren't driven out! Holy Smokes Your right!!!

Oh wait, "drive out" is a modern english idom,(http://www.thefreedictionary.com/drive+out) and the this part of the bible that you quoted was written 3500 years or so ago... So does that mean the term 'drive out.' has the same meaning as you understand it now?
Lets go back to the Hebrew and see what word "Drive out was translated from. The Hebrew word is: (ירש yarash) it means in this context:1) to seize, dispossess, take possession off, inherit, disinherit, occupy, impoverish, be an heir

Oh, there is that word I used to describe what the tribe of Juda and benjamin were doing to the land and of the people. They "occupied" the land of the broken Jebsuites.

So scripturally, God delivered upon his promise, and your modern interpertation of the term 'drive out' was misapplied to this passage.

"Just because "God is with someone" does not mean they use what is avaiable to them." Really? Let's again look at the actual text.

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"This is how you will know that the living God is among you and that he will certainly drive out before you the Canaanites, Hittites, Hivites, Perizzites, Girgashites, Amorites and Jebusites."

---

Here god says he will certainly drive all of those people out to show that he is with him. Judah need not 'use' god, god had already said he would do it of his own accord.

God did drive these people out as we have already established. Even though the tribe of Judea was beaten by iron charriots.

It's an ancient city, of course it is going to crumble eventually. The new city was built over the ancient ruins of the old one. Tell me, how many ancient cities still exist in their original states, and how many of those that do not would you say were permanantly destroyed by god. Note "never found again". Uh, it's right there.

So you've never heard of Rome, Damascus, Jericho, or Jersulem? These people seem to be able to not only use the same land but still use and maintain some of the same structures. While the orginal city of tyer was abandoned and a new civilization was built next to it.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/11/15...re_Lebanon
Just because the people who live there refer to their new dewelling as tyer does not mean it was the tyer of the bible. They wisly built next to (not on top of) what God destroyed.

Where were Sodom and Gomorrah anyway? Likewise, what reason do you have to believe that god cursed them when virtually every ancient culture disappeared long ago?

What are you talking about? If every ancient culture disappeared then where did we come from?