Atheism is not a belief!!

[The Reality Salesman01]

Atheism can be a belief.

It's called gnosticism Compare with agnosticism.

Atheism can have any definition in the world, so long as the individual assigning it is cool with accepting that the new definition (if anything other than a word that describes a lack of belief in Gods) is only valuable to them as it is a product of their own inherently ignorant interpretation.

[Violet]

Atheism can have any definition in the world, so long as the individual assigning it is cool with accepting that the new definition (if anything other than a word that describes a lack of belief in Gods) is only valuable to them as it is a product of their own inherently ignorant interpretation.

Or it can have just two... that depending upon whether they know there are no gods, or whether they don't know if there are any gods.

You're welcome to build straw houses all day long if you like, but I am not to be held accountable for any stray fire what comes your way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5EmnQp3V48

Son.

[The Reality Salesman01]

Atheism can have any definition in the world, so long as the individual assigning it is cool with accepting that the new definition (if anything other than a word that describes a lack of belief in Gods) is only valuable to them as it is a product of their own inherently ignorant interpretation.

Or it can have just two... that depending upon whether they know there are no gods, or whether they don't know if there are any gods.

You're welcome to build straw houses all day long if you like, but I am not to be held accountable for any stray fire what comes your way.

I'm avoiding a long inevitable discourse by cutting to the chase. Not a fan of straw.

Since the base of every God theory is an underlying unfalsifiable hypothesis, it really saves us the time of having the debate over whether anyone can "Know" a God exists or not.

There is no reason to believe in any God at all. That is not the same as saying that I believe he does not exist, and its certainly not the same as me claiming to "know" one way or the other.

Atheist only exist as a necessary biproduct of the individual making claims about Gods we don't believe.

I also don't believe that i'll wake up tomorrow with one less arm. I've had good luck so far and can see nothing to suggest that I should plan for such a thing, therefore, I don't believe its gonna happen. I am not saying it can't or its not going to happen simply because I have the inablility to show it false. But, the lack of evidence for such a thing is enough for me to sleep well and not consider such a thing as a possibility. This of course doesn't seem to warrant a title because there isn't a huge group of people called "Nocturnal Amputationists" attempting to convince me that it's a common occurence that I should begin preparing for. If there were, I'd be a "A-Nocturnal-Amputationist" too!
Any word you like that deals with the ignorant claims of having knowledge of such things is not of any interest to me. It's a waste of good discussion that's been beaten to death. So, again...I am an Atheist because I have no reason to believe any God claims. I remain at the default position of a questioning, sentient being. I am not interested in any other variations of any other levels of ignorance.

I am aware I don't have the answers, I am ok with not knowing, and no, I haven't heard any God theory that doesn't fall flat on its face, so, I don't accept it as an answer to any of the questions I don't have answers for. No more than I have any reason to add duct taping my arm to my chest to my evening routine before bed.

[EDIT] By the way, I'm on a government computer that doesn't allow access to YouTube or other fun video sites, so if you posted a video that was intended to be educational, I'm affraid I won't be able to be enlightened by it. You'll have to use your own brain to defend your thoughts through text.

[Violet]

I'm avoiding a long confusing inevitable discourse by cutting to the chase. Not a fan of straw.

Well then, why do you insist on using it to build you houses and your army?

Since the base of every God theory is an underlying unfalsifiable hypothesis, it really saves us the time of having the debate over whether anyone can "Know" a God exists or not.

Not necessarily

Plenty of falsifiable ones have shown up, plenty more have the potential of being falsified once your puny race can start galaxy-hopping.

Everyone can know a god does or doesn't exist, knowledge being wholly separate from the correctness of said knowledge.

There is no reason to believe in any God at all. That is not the same as saying that I believe he does not exist, and its certainly not the same as me claiming to "know" one way or the other.

I can think of a number of reasons to believe in any gods at all, a number of them are even very good ones (makes you feel good, gets your wife to bang you, kids more obedient since you're a shit authority figure... etc).

You believe no gods exist? Well good for you, you've just claimed to know that no gods exist. You're certain enough to believe one way or another.

Plenty of other atheists and theists are alright with not being certain... does this bug you?

Atheist only exist as a necessary biproduct of the individual making claims about Gods we don't believe.

Atheism only exists because theism exists. That is to say: everything is an atheist, unless it is a theist. Every rock, tree, and map on this planet is an atheist... theism is a product of having the mental capacity for faith. You don't subscribe to their beliefs, that's cool... you have your own set of beliefs and they hopefully work for you (the sidewalk isn't going to eat you as you walk along it. But I don't know, maybe you do believe that it might. I'm not you).

I also don't believe that i'll wake up tomorrow with one less arm.

Now that's just naivety.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iu13UrF3UDU

I've had good luck so far and can see nothing to suggest that I should plan for such a thing, therefore, I don't believe its gonna happen.

Heaven forbid you have bad luck once in your life

I am not saying it can't or its not going to happen simply because I have the inablility to show it false.

Yes, that's the kicker, isn't it? So then, you must be open to the idea that maybe one day you'll be convinced of a god or six.

But, the lack of evidence for such a thing is enough for me to sleep well and not consider such a thing as a possibility.

A lack of scientific evidence for metaphysical beings makes you certain that such things aren't a possibility?

This of course doesn't seem to warrant a title because there isn't a huge group of people called "Nocturnal Amputationists" attempting to convince me that it's a common occurence that I should begin preparing for. If there were, I'd be a "A-Nocturnal-Amputationist" too!

Oh, I wouldn't be too sure. You might give me ideas.

Any word you like that deals with the ignorant claims of having knowledge of such things is not of any interest to me.

So... you're still talking, towards something I've said, though you've no interest in anything I have to say?

Cool story, bro.

It's a waste of good discussion that's been beaten to death.

And yet, alive and well it is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9tAKLTktY0

So, again...I am an Atheist because I have no reason to believe any God claims.

No, you're an atheist because you don't believe in any gods. There's a difference, Max

I remain at the default position of a questioning, sentient being. I am not interested in any other variations of any other levels of ignorance.

Oh, so you're a baby? Mighty fine vocabulary you've got there, baby, but you might want to work on your sentence structure.

I mean, that second sentence is totally intelligible. Something about not being interested in ignorance, wondering now if he ever drinks or gets laid.

I am aware I don't have the answers, I am ok with not knowing, and no, and I haven't heard any God theory that doesn't fall flat on its face, so, I don't accept it as an answer to any of the questions I don't have answers for.

That's just the thing... you do have the answers. Infact, you're the only who has any answers, since the world is you, and you came into being only last thursday.

Seems to me you aren't creative enough to come up with a 'god theory' what doesn't fall flat on its face... so what would your answers be worth anyway?

---

[EDIT] By the way, I'm on a government computer that doesn't allow access to YouTube or other fun video sites, so if you posted a video that was intended to be educational, I'm affraid I won't be able to be enlightened by it. You'll have to use your own brain to defend your thoughts through text.

All the better, your own inabilities illustrate the point as a master painter illustrates his canvas.

[The Reality Salesman01]

Amusing as some of this was its riddled with fallacies. I hope you haven't mistaken my use of the word "ignorant" as an insult. It's true of all of us as a description of our KNOWLEDGE of such things as Gods. I'm not sure which word you conflated with me admitting I'm a baby, but I assure you I'm not! By the way, I'm from Frisco! Not far from you!

Lets cut to the chase, eh? It's not my intention to insult you and we could spend all day disagreeing on what constitutes knowledge and the differences between probable and possible and the similarities between faith and irrationality. We shouldn't have to, but none the less, this exchange shows we most certainly would. At any rate, to avoid any further misrepresentations of each others views...

What's your claim? Describe to me the God you think is possible, and perhaps why I or anybody else should agree from a logical standpoint.

[Jackalope]

Also, where are the dark babies anyway? Back of the picture I bet - fucking bigots.

Picture? I thought it was a menu.

[Minimalist]

Yeah and they spout off a bible verse or two as if that shit means something. Fuck 'em. I give them no credit at all. Little more than parrots without the pretty feathers.

To be fair, the people in Chopra's camp, or other not-necessarily-Jesus-oriented-New-Age-bullshit, do the same thing.

They're assholes, too.

[Dawud]

To say that you can never know if there is God or not is a belief about the nature of the world.

If you truly are open either way then make sure you don't fall into this trap too!

---

I do maintain that belief or knowledge about agnosticism regarding a subject can motivate behaviour.

My knowledge that I don't know about a topic for an exam can motivate me to study...

The knowledge that a person knows not either way about God can also influence someone too... e.g. I think that I will find out more or - I will explain to someone why I have no knowledge. A concrete example of this is Dawkins book God delusion - he was aware of his agnosticism and he chose to explain this.

It seems obvious and outside of this forum I'm sure people could accept this but there seems to be a suspicion by some that admitting the above is falling into some evil plan I have...

I don't think this undermines atheism - just undermines this idea that someone agnostic cannot be motivated by their agnosticism or their awareness of it....

[Violet]

Amusing as some of this was its riddled with fallacies. I hope you haven't mistaken my use of the word "ignorant" as an insult. It's true of all of us as a description of our KNOWLEDGE of such things as Gods. I'm not sure which word you conflated with me admitting I'm a baby, but I assure you I'm not! By the way, I'm from Frisco! Not far from you!

More people throwing around 'fallacy'? TIBERIUS: give these people a logic school. They appear to be in desperate need of it. Bonus points if it ends with every one of them screaming 'you're racist!'.

Anyway, I hope you haven't mistaken your possessing knowledge to be anything more than ignorance. I could nanny you into understanding why I made the word choice I made, but I prefer to let children explore the world, and come to their own conclusions.

Lets cut to the chase, eh? It's not my intention to insult you and we could spend all day disagreeing on what constitutes knowledge and the differences between probable and possible and the similarities between faith and irrationality. We shouldn't have to, but none the less, this exchange shows we most certainly would. At any rate, to avoid any further misrepresentations of each others views...

Insult schminsult, irrelevant. We probably couldn't spend all day disagreeing upon what constitutes knowledge, given how I'd accept your definition of knowledge under the notation that it's not what I'm arguing, then invent a new word to explain what I am arguing. It'll probably be 'Tusfencain'.

Probable and possible, the first is a likely possibility, the latter is only that it can happen.

If faith is irrational, we are all irrational.

Rather, we should have to... given that we're subjective beings and all.

What's your claim? Describe to me the God you think is possible, and perhaps why I or anybody else should agree from a logical standpoint.

I think many gods are possible... since the world came into being yesterday and everything you even know (including logic) is wrong. Using logic on gods is very shortsighted, as it pigeonholes them into an existence as we might be able to understand it.

That said, what's a logical standpoint worth? You don't use it for science [i](you take it on faith under the weight of evidence you have also taken on faith)[i], and you don't use in when plotting your route somewhere (also faith)... really, I don't see how anyone logically accepts anything. They might use logic as their reasoning behind their acceptance of a thing, but it is ultimately faith which bridges the gap between acceptance and nonacceptance.

[Neo-Scholastic]

Atheism by definition is a lack of belief in God; however that lack of belief itself entails certain other beliefs, not all of which are fully justified.