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Atheism is not a belief!!
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 (April 25, 2013 at 12:59 pm)Violet Lilly Blossom Wrote: Atheism can be a belief. Atheism can have any definition in the world, so long as the individual assigning it is cool with accepting that the new definition (if anything other than a word that describes a lack of belief in Gods) is only valuable to them as it is a product of their own inherently ignorant interpretation.  Please give me a home where cloud buffalo roam
Where the dear and the strangers can play
Where sometimes is heard a discouraging word
But the skies are not stormy all day
RE: Atheism is not a belief!!
April 25, 2013 at 1:29 pm
(This post was last modified: April 25, 2013 at 1:39 pm by The Reality Salesman01.)
(April 25, 2013 at 1:08 pm)Violet Lilly Blossom Wrote:(April 25, 2013 at 1:04 pm)Texas Sailor Wrote: Atheism can have any definition in the world, so long as the individual assigning it is cool with accepting that the new definition (if anything other than a word that describes a lack of belief in Gods) is only valuable to them as it is a product of their own inherently ignorant interpretation. I'm avoiding a long inevitable discourse by cutting to the chase. Not a fan of straw. Since the base of every God theory is an underlying unfalsifiable hypothesis, it really saves us the time of having the debate over whether anyone can "Know" a God exists or not. There is no reason to believe in any God at all. That is not the same as saying that I believe he does not exist, and its certainly not the same as me claiming to "know" one way or the other. Atheist only exist as a necessary biproduct of the individual making claims about Gods we don't believe. I also don't believe that i'll wake up tomorrow with one less arm. I've had good luck so far and can see nothing to suggest that I should plan for such a thing, therefore, I don't believe its gonna happen. I am not saying it can't or its not going to happen simply because I have the inablility to show it false. But, the lack of evidence for such a thing is enough for me to sleep well and not consider such a thing as a possibility. This of course doesn't seem to warrant a title because there isn't a huge group of people called "Nocturnal Amputationists" attempting to convince me that it's a common occurence that I should begin preparing for. If there were, I'd be a "A-Nocturnal-Amputationist" too! Any word you like that deals with the ignorant claims of having knowledge of such things is not of any interest to me. It's a waste of good discussion that's been beaten to death. So, again...I am an Atheist because I have no reason to believe any God claims. I remain at the default position of a questioning, sentient being. I am not interested in any other variations of any other levels of ignorance. I am aware I don't have the answers, I am ok with not knowing, and no, I haven't heard any God theory that doesn't fall flat on its face, so, I don't accept it as an answer to any of the questions I don't have answers for. No more than I have any reason to add duct taping my arm to my chest to my evening routine before bed. [EDIT] By the way, I'm on a government computer that doesn't allow access to YouTube or other fun video sites, so if you posted a video that was intended to be educational, I'm affraid I won't be able to be enlightened by it. You'll have to use your own brain to defend your thoughts through text. RE: Atheism is not a belief!!
April 25, 2013 at 1:54 pm
(This post was last modified: April 25, 2013 at 1:56 pm by Violet.)
Please give me a home where cloud buffalo roam
Where the dear and the strangers can play
Where sometimes is heard a discouraging word
But the skies are not stormy all day
Amusing as some of this was its riddled with fallacies. I hope you haven't mistaken my use of the word "ignorant" as an insult. It's true of all of us as a description of our KNOWLEDGE of such things as Gods. I'm not sure which word you conflated with me admitting I'm a baby, but I assure you I'm not! By the way, I'm from Frisco! Not far from you!
Lets cut to the chase, eh? It's not my intention to insult you and we could spend all day disagreeing on what constitutes knowledge and the differences between probable and possible and the similarities between faith and irrationality. We shouldn't have to, but none the less, this exchange shows we most certainly would. At any rate, to avoid any further misrepresentations of each others views... What's your claim? Describe to me the God you think is possible, and perhaps why I or anybody else should agree from a logical standpoint.   (April 25, 2013 at 10:25 am)thesummerqueen Wrote:(April 25, 2013 at 10:22 am)Minimalist Wrote: Yeah and they spout off a bible verse or two as if that shit means something. Fuck 'em. I give them no credit at all. Little more than parrots without the pretty feathers. They're assholes, too.  RE: Atheism is not a belief!!
April 25, 2013 at 5:31 pm
(This post was last modified: April 25, 2013 at 5:39 pm by Dawud.)
To say that you can never know if there is God or not is a belief about the nature of the world.
If you truly are open either way then make sure you don't fall into this trap too! I do maintain that belief or knowledge about agnosticism regarding a subject can motivate behaviour. My knowledge that I don't know about a topic for an exam can motivate me to study... The knowledge that a person knows not either way about God can also influence someone too... e.g. I think that I will find out more or - I will explain to someone why I have no knowledge. A concrete example of this is Dawkins book God delusion - he was aware of his agnosticism and he chose to explain this. It seems obvious and outside of this forum I'm sure people could accept this but there seems to be a suspicion by some that admitting the above is falling into some evil plan I have... I don't think this undermines atheism - just undermines this idea that someone agnostic cannot be motivated by their agnosticism or their awareness of it....
Kudos given by (1): Dawud
(April 25, 2013 at 2:31 pm)Texas Sailor Wrote: Amusing as some of this was its riddled with fallacies. I hope you haven't mistaken my use of the word "ignorant" as an insult. It's true of all of us as a description of our KNOWLEDGE of such things as Gods. I'm not sure which word you conflated with me admitting I'm a baby, but I assure you I'm not! By the way, I'm from Frisco! Not far from you! More people throwing around 'fallacy'? TIBERIUS: give these people a logic school. They appear to be in desperate need of it. Bonus points if it ends with every one of them screaming 'you're racist!'. Anyway, I hope you haven't mistaken your possessing knowledge to be anything more than ignorance. I could nanny you into understanding why I made the word choice I made, but I prefer to let children explore the world, and come to their own conclusions. Quote:Lets cut to the chase, eh? It's not my intention to insult you and we could spend all day disagreeing on what constitutes knowledge and the differences between probable and possible and the similarities between faith and irrationality. We shouldn't have to, but none the less, this exchange shows we most certainly would. At any rate, to avoid any further misrepresentations of each others views... Insult schminsult, irrelevant. We probably couldn't spend all day disagreeing upon what constitutes knowledge, given how I'd accept your definition of knowledge under the notation that it's not what I'm arguing, then invent a new word to explain what I am arguing. It'll probably be 'Tusfencain'. Probable and possible, the first is a likely possibility, the latter is only that it can happen. If faith is irrational, we are all irrational. Rather, we should have to... given that we're subjective beings and all. Quote:What's your claim? Describe to me the God you think is possible, and perhaps why I or anybody else should agree from a logical standpoint. I think many gods are possible... since the world came into being yesterday and everything you even know (including logic) is wrong. Using logic on gods is very shortsighted, as it pigeonholes them into an existence as we might be able to understand it. That said, what's a logical standpoint worth? You don't use it for science [i](you take it on faith under the weight of evidence you have also taken on faith)[i], and you don't use in when plotting your route somewhere (also faith)... really, I don't see how anyone logically accepts anything. They might use logic as their reasoning behind their acceptance of a thing, but it is ultimately faith which bridges the gap between acceptance and nonacceptance. 
Please give me a home where cloud buffalo roam
Where the dear and the strangers can play
Where sometimes is heard a discouraging word
But the skies are not stormy all day
Atheism by definition is a lack of belief in God; however that lack of belief itself entails certain other beliefs, not all of which are fully justified.
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Compare with agnosticism.
