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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 19, 2014 at 5:45 pm
(This post was last modified: July 19, 2014 at 6:08 pm by Whateverist.)
(July 19, 2014 at 4:57 pm)Rhythm Wrote: Here a good one.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Great-Transfor...0385721242
There's a section in there about what the bible is-and-isn't saying...as part of the larger narrative of the changing landscape of religious traditions. I like this one - because it actually takes the time to explain the practical experience of the cultures that told these evolving narratives, why the narratives made sense - here in the real world- to them. We sometimes forget that it;s only recently that we've separated the magical or spiritual world from the natural one. Such a distinction would be non-sense to the people who conceived of these narratives. Something could happen in fairy land and it would be just as real and corporeal as something that happened here, in our world. That's why the narratives were relevant to begin with.
But.....if you don't take the time to learn this, or if you willfully ignore it in favor of theology, the narratives fall apart, become useless. Instead of discussing a rich collective human experience (which is the narratives birthright) you start bickering like an asshole with people who don't think that a dragon actually convinced a woman to eat cursed fruit. LOL, I actually joined this forum for discussions of the former sort...and ended up settling for the latter. The shit these people think their bible is telling them, honestly, surprises the hell out of me. Sure, I've never been in the fold...but I was literally surrounded by and infused with "the faith" - and I'd never heard the garbage I've seen on these boards - until I joined these boards. Gods been getting smaller and less relevant with every creatard and fundy that happens to fall into my lap here - from my POV.
I'm going to check out your recommendation.
As for why we get so much more crud than creme settling into our laps .. I wish I knew. Would much rather hear from people who can challenge my thinking than those whose tricked out strawmen insult my intelligence. Should we advertise?
Looking for a few good theists.
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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 19, 2014 at 11:06 pm
(July 19, 2014 at 11:52 am)whateverist Wrote: (July 19, 2014 at 1:45 am)Rhythm Wrote: Lemme ask you this. Why do you need this narrative to be factual? Why? What theology is affected? None. Did christ make a promise - but only so long as there was a flood? No.
This would be such a good question for you to consider, Snowpeas. Look into some of the other possible uses of text beyond conveying facts. Look into your own religion and try to decide what is really central to it. I worry that the way you're using the bible will cause brain rot. isn't that the way it goes? I provide biblical evidence that support the atheists' position that there wasn't a global flood and as an expression of gratitude, I get a surly attitude.
Atheist Credo: A universe by chance that also just happened to admit the observer by chance.
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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 19, 2014 at 11:10 pm
(This post was last modified: July 19, 2014 at 11:13 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
There was no deluge Tracks. None. Of course it wasn't global, it just wasn't regional either. Am I supposed to hand you a cookie for being willing to meet me halfway to the truth? 
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 20, 2014 at 2:52 pm
We're not looking for biblical evidence, snowflake; at least I'm not. We already know what your book says. I, for one, would settle for the tiniest bit of physical evidence. Got any?
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 20, 2014 at 2:53 pm
(This post was last modified: July 20, 2014 at 2:54 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
I don't think that Tracks actually expects to find any. My offer's still on the table, not being availed of.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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Re: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 20, 2014 at 5:31 pm
Not that I'm defending flood stories, but there are some interesting theories regarding glacial floods at the end of the last ice age being the Bibles source. Most likely these happened in many places over differing periods of time forming the global aspects.
Quote: Recognition of the Missoula flood helped other geologists identify similar landforms in Asia, Europe, Alaska, and the American Midwest, as well as on Mars. There is now compelling evidence for many gigantic ancient floods where glacial ice dams failed time and again: At the end of the last glaciation, some 10,000 years ago, giant ice-dammed lakes in Eurasia and North America repeatedly produced huge floods
http://discovermagazine.com/2012/jul-aug...y-enormous
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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 20, 2014 at 5:41 pm
(This post was last modified: July 20, 2014 at 5:42 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Yeah, and there are tsunamis and rogue waves, and sewer overflow. None of which has any bearing on the deluge. This is the sort of hazy shit that the faithful like to point to, but "floods exist" does not equal "the deluge". I couldn't even draw a direct line from any particular flood as a source. The source flood in the deluge is an entirely imaginary one in every single aspect. It's based on floods the same way that Briar Rabbit is based on there having been rabbits in the world.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 20, 2014 at 5:47 pm
I think its more akin to Chinese whispers. Something MAY have happened to trigger an initial legend, but its been distorted into a completely new story.
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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 20, 2014 at 5:52 pm
(This post was last modified: July 20, 2014 at 5:53 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
I think that even suggesting this is so is a stretch. Why? People couldn't have written about a flood that never happened? I doubt JK Rowling ever saw a magical car whisk kids of to fairy school.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Abiogenesis is impossible
July 20, 2014 at 5:57 pm
My take on this is that someone back in biblical times found some fossil seashells or similar on a mountain and thought the only way they could have got there was if the mountain was once under the sea. Which of course it would have been, back when it was part of the seabed before getting uplifted into a mountain.
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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