Is There a Point To Living a Moral Life?

[genkaus]

there was sect of Christians that did cut their dicks off. Cant remember what they were called which is maddening.

Skoptsy?

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genkaus, you beat me to it!

FIRST. Hell yeah.

[Lemonvariable72]

Skoptsy?

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genkaus, you beat me to it!

FIRST. Hell yeah.

I shouldve thought of the fact of life I just explained to my father, if you have an idea, chances are 10000 other people had it first

[max-greece]

Genkaus,

I'm happy - you nailed it - also happy to accept that proto-morality is less than 1% of today's - or whatever figure you want to use. Proto-morality just the starting point.

Glad we got there in the end.

[Mister Agenda]

See the problem with de-nihilists, is this. They trust their conscience, but not its source. They form ethical systems based on reason without accepting the basis of the world's rational order. Its been 14 pages of "works for me" without any reflection on why it works. Nihilism is the logical conclusion of atheism. De-nilhism is the refusing to face that conclusion.

Did you make up that term yourself or did some other atheist-basher coin it for you?

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See the problem with de-nihilists, is this. They trust their conscience, but not its source. They form ethical systems based on reason without accepting the basis of the world's rational order.

What? That isn't intelligible to me. Elaborate please?

Sounds like presuppositionalism to me. God invented reason so when you use reason without acknowledging God, you're doing it wrong. A more honest rendering of Wooter's last sentence would be 'They form ethical systems based on reason without accepting my view of reality as the basis of the world's rational order'.

And no, I'm not a nihilist in case you were wondering, though nor am I apposed to some forms of nihilism, even if I don't hold to them.

But you've GOT to be a nihilist if you're an atheist! Wooters doesn't even leave that as an option! It's like you're saying it takes more than Wooters claiming something to make it so. It's not Wooter's opinion, it's GOD's, Wooter's just the middle man and it's not his fault that God didn't give him more persuasive material to work with.

[Angrboda]

Are you suggesting there are qualities that humans possess that aren't biological? Whether they are needed to survive or not, or are imperative, if the only qualities which exist are biological, then the set of non-biological qualities is empty, and your assertion is empty and false.

What qualities are you suggesting are not biological? Your statement seems to imply a dualism, whether property or substance. Are you a property or substance dualist?

Yes, I am suggesting that there are qualities that human possess that aren't biological - and biological here refers to "of genetic origin".

When you decide to start dealing from your own private dictionary, please do us a favor and warn us. This is not what biological means. Full stop. This is an equivocation, and seems to clearly indicate that you understand neither biology nor evolution. (I'm also persuaded you don't understand the first thing about morality, but that contention hasn't fully clarified itself yet and will have to await another day.) Moreover, I suspect this equivocation is driven by your need to justify your compatibilist views and your moral theories. You're trying to carve a space where no space exists because you can't reach your conclusions any other way.

I regard human qualities related to consciousness - such as capacity to reason, sentience etc. - as non-biological in nature, even though I do accept that their mode of operation if biological. And no, this does not imply substance dualism.

This is nonsensical double-speak. I can only assume you're dealing from your own private dictionary again. When you feel like communicating in English, please let me know.

[Sword of Christ]

But you've GOT to be a nihilist if you're an atheist!

"It's the emptiness that's left, it is like a despair destroying this world and I have been trying to help it."





If you take "this world" to mean the world of faith/religion/belief in God. Yes so it would just be reality if it's true not nihilism but certainly it's still a very dark reality.

[Jackalope]

But you've GOT to be a nihilist if you're an atheist!

"It's the emptiness that's left, it is like a despair destroying this world and I have been trying to help it."





If you take "this world" to mean the world of faith/religion/belief in God. Yes so it would just be reality if it's true not nihilism but certainly it's still a very dark reality.

Non-sequitur and a fallacious appeal to consequences.

[Esquilax]

If you take "this world" to mean the world of faith/religion/belief in God. Yes so it would just be reality if it's true not nihilism but certainly it's still a very dark reality.

Could you do me a favor and stop talking about things you cannot possibly know anything about as if you're an expert?

[Sword of Christ]

Non-sequitur and a fallacious appeal to consequences.

If you're going to seriously reject the existence of God or a purpose to the universe/life you will have to face the consequences of the truth which is going to be a little bit nihilistic whether you like it or not.

[Lemonvariable72]

But you've GOT to be a nihilist if you're an atheist!

"It's the emptiness that's left, it is like a despair destroying this world and I have been trying to help it."





If you take "this world" to mean the world of faith/religion/belief in God. Yes so it would just be reality if it's true not nihilism but certainly it's still a very dark reality.

Sigh, most secular morality boils down to hedonism, which is usually applied in 2 ways. On a personal level use the golden rule as written by say Confucius ( or at least one of his students) and on a larger scale moral utilitarianism. These principles guide nearly every good moral decision made in the last 1000 year ( on a large scale) infact the us bill of rights is largely a embodiment of moral utilitarianism.