Why are other civilizations ignored in the Bible?

[Rahul]

You hope not and yet you persistently ask for evidence for Christianity. This seems odd to me.

You hope not......

Kind of reminds me of some things other atheists have said regarding their atheism. Thomas Nagel and Aldous Huxley come to mind.

The idea of hoping God does not exist, not wanting God to exist, finding reasons to not believe in God all speak of an issue that is not an intellectual one, but rather an emotional one.

I wanted god and heaven to exist. I didn't leave Christianity and become an atheist because I wanted to. I became an atheist because it was the only logical stance I could make sense of.

When I debate theists like you I am hoping one of you will point out what I'm missing. Tell me how my uncomfortable conclusions are false.

After all these years though I don't really believe that any of you have it.

So I'm operating under the assumption that said evidence doesn't exist.

Anything can happen though. Maybe I'll be surprised one day.

I really kind of doubt it, though

[max-greece]

It does not follow from this that God is to blame. Blame the men and women who desire to be called Christians but do not obey Christ's teachings.

This, of course, is always the cop out response. Its not God's fault (never is) its those that "desire to be called Christians...."

Now here's the thing. Take Catholics and any Protestant Church. I have no reason to doubt that each sincerely believes that they are on the right path and the other on the wrong path. Each has adherents that claim communication with God on the matter and each is convinced of the rightness of their case.

Let us assume, for the sake of argument, that neither is attempting to deceive the other - making unfounded claims or even lying. Each is utterly sincere.

At least one of them has to be wrong. Even in the event that God accepts them both they have waged wars on each other on the basis that the other is wrong.

Now with 2 truly believing parties that are so convinced they will wage war to prove it you are saying its their fault? Really?

Gotta be honest here - I don't see how. Even if they are wrong I am certain they honestly believe themselves to be right - enough martyrs on both sides to show their sincerity.

Any way you cut it - its a mess. To me it is simply wilful not to lay the blame squarely at the door to which it belongs.

[catman]

Interesting to note that Yahweh was part of the Canaanite pantheon of Gods. All the other ones were fake though.

[Tonus]

Then Spider Woman made all the plants, the flowers, the bushes, and the trees. Likewise she made the birds and animals, again using earth and singing the Creation Song. When all this was done, she made human beings, using yellow, red, white, and black earth mixed with her saliva. Singing the Creation Song, she made four men, and then in her own form she made four women.

Having finished her work, she embarked on a new career:

---

Of course real evidence can be explained away. Humans possess great imaginations.

This is true, though it leaves us back at square one. After all, in the same way that people can dismiss evidence that leads to conclusions they don't like, they can also accept evidence if it leads to conclusions they desire to be true. A person who follows that path rigidly enough will accept only the evidence that supports what they desire and will dismiss the evidence that undermines that hope. My understanding is that psychologists have discovered that our brains work this way by default, and that we try to reinforce our beliefs in exactly this manner.

Therefore, any evidence that can be explained away is simply insufficient.

[Cyberman]

Blame the men and women who desire to be called Christians but do not obey Christ's teachings.

Would you count yourself among that category? Remember, when you point the finger at other people, you have four fingers pointing at yourself.

[discipulus]

I miss your point. Maybe you can elaborate?

Well, guys from history writing about another guy who they could not possibly have met because he died before they were born isn't exactly compelling evidence for the existence of that guy, is it? People today are doing that about Christ; just the fact that it happened slightly closer to his time of life doesn't change the fact that it didn't get written while he was alive.

I have spoken with a gentleman in the past regarding this point. He essentially said the same thing you have said i.e. that since none of the people who wrote about Jesus wrote what they did while He was alive that therefore the accounts we do have cannot be regarded as reliable.

Is this a good argument. No it is not. For it assumes that in order for an account of a person's life to be reliable the account must be written while the person is alive.

I am not aware of any historian who holds this view. It would be great if we did have an account of Christ written by someone while Christ was alive but we do not. If historians made this the sole prerequisite in determining the reliabilty of an account of a person's life then a great many historical accounts of other people would also have to be deemed unreliable.

I suggest you study the historical method and the various means utilized in historiography.

---

Blame the men and women who desire to be called Christians but do not obey Christ's teachings.

Would you count yourself among that category? Remember, when you point the finger at other people, you have four fingers pointing at yourself.

Many times in the past I confess that I have failed to obey Christ's teachings. I have no one to blame for this failure but myself.

[Cyberman]

Is this a good argument. No it is not.

No it isn't, but then I think you missed the point. When the only accounts of a person and associated events - particularly when they were supposed to be so world altering - come from one single collated source written by people with a vested interest and an agenda; when generals and historians contemporaneous with the alleged events and who lived, travelled and fought in the locations where these events are meant to have taken place and yet wrote nothing about them, while at the same time writing copious works about actual real events and people; when some of this extra-biblical evidence is known to have been tampered with at a later date by people trying to create corroborating evidence that clearly isn't there (otherwise why bother?) - that's when alarm bells ought to be sounding with regards to your 'reliable sources'.

Would you count yourself among that category? Remember, when you point the finger at other people, you have four fingers pointing at yourself.

Many times in the past I confess that I have failed to obey Christ's teachings. I have no one to blame for this failure but myself.

And yet you still consider yourself a xtian. By what metric, then, can you possibly determine that others might not be, since by your own estimation you would fall into that same category?

[Jacob(smooth)]

Blame the men and women who desire to be called Christians but do not obey Christ's teachings.

Would you count yourself among that category? Remember, when you point the finger at other people, you have four fingers pointing at yourself.

Technically 3.

But the point is a good one. If a few outliers get stuff wrong, well, there are a few in any class. But when opinion on core doctrines is split down the middle by people honestly seeking God...

If any of these divisive issues are salvation critical then the kingdom of God becomes nothing more than a meritocracy, populated by people clever enough to work out the game of transcendental peekaboo and reach the right conclusion about the right God.

I can't see any reason better than "take it on faith" to think of that as other than inconsistent .

Sorry, grumpy. The cynicism is strong today.

[pocaracas]

Remember, when you point the finger at other people, you have four fingers pointing at yourself.

I don't know how you people point, but...
I use one finger aiming where I'm pointing...
The thumb is aiming down..ish
And the remaining 3 point to the right (if I use my right hand), although... they're kind of curled up and each of the 3 bones in each finger is pointing in one direction (left, backwards!, and right)

[Cyberman]

Yeah, I had a blond moment regarding the number of fingers (hey, I never claimed to be perfect!)