Apparently football is a sin now

[Napoléon]

Firstly, I'm not justyfing anything

You are.

I'm just saying I don't understand the relationship between a country's politics and their capacity to host a sports even in the future with all the requirements

Would you think it's acceptable to host the world cup in a country that treats black people as second class citizens? Or would you think that the governing body who makes those decisions should have a moral obligation to give the world cup to a country that treats its citizens as equals?

Secondly, it is better to pay a fine than going to jail or facing the death penalty, anyone will understand that. And thirdly, between keeping my mouth shut and facing a 50000 fine, I'd prefer keeping my mouth shut in public, considering 80% of the population would be hostile to me, it's a reasonable and rational cost of opportunity, not to mention I could lose my life.

You're completely missing the point. Neither option is acceptable. What you're doing is saying one is fine and nobody should care because the alternatives are far worse. It may be true that the alternatives are worse, but it doesn't make it any better to be oppressed. So again, quit justifying oppression.

---

My proposal is to protest against it peacefully and not by forcibly breaking the law, I don't think Russians would have a problem arresting all gay people.

Because peaceful protests always go well in Russia. Do you even watch the news?

[The Grand Nudger]

So you propose putting a minority in risk of death against 80% of the Russian population? So proposing something that can get them killed by anti-gay extremists is reasonable? I don't think so. My proposal is to protest against it peacefully and not by forcibly breaking the law, I don't think Russians would have a problem arresting all gay people.. And then when? Who'd fight for gay rights?

They're already at risk, it's illegal to be themselves. Would you put a minority at risk opposing the 80% of citizens who are in favor of fascism?

"There are alot of em, they're the kind of assholes that might jail us, it's really hard - so I guess we'll just do it their way"?......... Reach down and grab your nuts homey. Hell, grab somebody else's nuts - in protest.

A quick question out of ignorance, what does "one-sies" mean?

LOL, very peculiar american slang, "all by yourself".

[Dystopia]

You are.

I'm not. I said I was against Russia's anti-gay law from the beginning, I merely pointed out there are more severe cases

Would you think it's acceptable to host the world cup in a country that treats black people as second class citizens? Or would you think that the governing body who makes those decisions should have a moral obligation to give the world cup to a country that treats its citizens as equals?

No, but if the Crimea crisis didn't justify banning the world cup I doubt gay people having less freedom of expression will justify it. What about Qatar? What if we hosted it in Turkey? Maybe FIFA would accept it and they have problems with human rights, it's far worse to be gay in Turkey. I'll stick to my point, as long as the law is not enforced on athletes, I don't see a reason to not host the world cup if they have financial conditions and good stadiums. I don't care about their politics.

You're completely missing the point. Neither option is acceptable. What you're doing is saying one if fine and nobody should care because the alternatives are far worse. It may be true that the alternatives are worse, but it doesn't make it any better to be oppressed. So again, quit justifying oppression.

I'm not justifying oppression, will you stop putting words in my mouth? You said it right, alternatives are worse. If you are in Russian and are gay, my advice to you is either deal with the law or emigrate (the last one would be better). i'm not saying this isn't bad, but considering the practical situations and the fact russian doesn't give a shit about international organizations, what alternative is there? How many people will die fighting for rights?

Because peaceful protests always go well in Russia. Do you even watch the news?

As a matter of fact I do. You just corroborated my views, if protests are useless and so is breaking the law, what alternative (viable and possible according to Russia's government and people) is there? I'm still waiting to know

[The Grand Nudger]

Throw in the towel I guess....to avoid breaking the law.

[Dystopia]

They're already at risk, it's illegal to be themselves. Would you put a minority at risk opposing the 80% of citizens who are in favor of fascism?

No, I'd emigrate... And my government doesn't support fascism, Russia's government supports anti-gay activism, if they don't have the people and the government on their side it's though for them out there. Again I will ask, what proposal do you have that can reliably change Russia's government and people?

LOL, very peculiar american slang, "all by yourself".

If you by any chance you were suggesting I was against gays or homophobic or against people's rights you are completely wrong (I may be wrong in deducting this so forgive me)

[Napoléon]

Again I will ask, what proposal do you have that can reliably change Russia's government and people?

I'll tell you what I don't propose, sitting on your arse and mindlessly allowing injustice to continue, which seems to be what you're suggesting.

[Dystopia]

Again I will ask, what proposal do you have that can reliably change Russia's government and people?

I'll tell you what I don't propose, sitting on your arse and mindlessly allowing injustice to continue, which seems to be what you're suggesting.

If protest don't work, breaking the law doesn't, and international bans/protests don't, what is your proposal? If you don't have one you are literally sitting your ass mindlessly.

[The Grand Nudger]

No, I'd emigrate... And my government doesn't support fascism, Russia's government supports anti-gay activism, if they don't have the people and the government on their side it's though for them out there. Again I will ask, what proposal do you have that can reliably change Russia's government and people?

Yeah, that's the ticket, they outta get the hell out of the place they were born, where all of their family is at. It's either that or upset the bigots applecart. Wouldn't want to do that, I suppose.

Lets try this again Black -if- 80% of the people in your country supported facism - set it as the law of the land, what would you do, and would you wonder why others -who might want to stay (for some arcane reason) would "want to break the law"?

If you by any chance were suggesting I was against gays or homophobic or against people's rights you are completely wrong (I may be wrong in deducting this so forgive me)

No, I'm suggesting that the russian apologetics I've seen in this thread are weak, and frankly- disgusting.

[Napoléon]

If protest don't work, breaking the law doesn't, and international bans/protests don't, what is your proposal? If you don't have one you are literally sitting your ass mindlessly.

No, it just means I don't have one. Doesn't mean there isn't one and it certainly doesn't mean I think it's acceptable and that we should just ignore the issue. Again, your attitude is one of "oh, it happens, what you gonna do about it, nothing, oh well".

[The Grand Nudger]

-which is exactly the sort of attitude that damn near ensures that it continues to happen. So congratz on that, I guess.