A reason for Islam?

[abtaylor]

So, I feel like the only time I come on here is to ask you guys for advice or to help me with some sort of problem pertaining to something I don't know, but could I get something verified?

So, my mom, aunt, their husbands, and all of their kids (excluding me) are Muslims. I've tried debating them a few times, and every time, they always bring up this thing about how some guy knew exactly how a baby formed in the womb (trimesters, developmental stages, etc.) and how NO ONE could have POSSIBLY knew that at that time. This is their basis for believing in Islam. (Also I should include how they both live in countries where if you denounce Islam or say you don't believe in it, they can basically put you to death. But, that's a different story)

I don't really know how valid this is or if it's even true, just looking for some validity because I can't seem to find anything about it online. You guys seem to know all about this stuff

[downbeatplumb]

The language of the Koran is flowery and vague and can be retro-fitted to kinda concur with almost anything.
It is the Rorsache ink blot of writing, if you squint at it you can see what you want.

[Baqal]

I suppose they're referring to this:
The Believers - سورة المؤمنون
[23:14] Then We made the sperm-drop into a clinging clot, and We made the clot into a lump of flesh, and We made from the lump, bones, and We covered the bones with flesh; then We developed him into another creation. So blessed is Allah, the best of creators.

Or this:
The Troops - سورة الزمر
[39:6] He created you from one soul. Then He made from it its mate, and He produced for you from the grazing livestock eight mates. He creates you in the wombs of your mothers, creation after creation, within three darknesses. That is Allah, your Lord; to Him belongs dominion. There is no deity except Him, so how are you averted?

Or this:
The Pilgrimage - سورة الحج
[22:5] O People, if you should be in doubt about the Resurrection, then consider that indeed, We created you from dust, then from a sperm-drop, then from a clinging clot, and then from a lump of flesh, formed and unformed - that We may show you. And We settle in the wombs whom We will for a specified term, then We bring you out as a child, and then We develop you that you may reach your time of maturity. And among you is he who is taken in early death, and among you is he who is returned to the most decrepit old age so that he knows, after once having knowledge, nothing. And you see the earth barren, but when We send down upon it rain, it quivers and swells and grows something of every beautiful kind.

Nothing but vague descriptions that do not prove that the Quran is divinely inspired, nor that Allah is real.

[pocaracas]

Here's what seems like a well researched article on the subject:
http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Sci...mbryo.html

In conclusion then there is not a single statement contained in the Qur'an relating to modern embryology that was not well known through direct observation by the ancient Greek and Indian physicians many centuries before the Qur'an was written. Morever, much of what the Qur'an actually does say about embryology is scientifically inaccurate. The ancient physicians' works were translated into Syriac in the century preceeding Muhammed, and were therefore accessible to non-Greek speakers. We know that one of the Companions of the Prophet was a doctor who trained at the very same medical school that the Greek translations were kept and taught at. We even know that at least one of the verses which describes embryology, sura 23:14 contains the words of another of Muhammed's companions. We are forced to conclude that, far from proving the alleged divine credentials of the Qur'an, its embryological statements actually provide further convincing evidence for its human origins.

Enjoy!

[The Grand Nudger]

Not only did they have access to greek science (and this holds throughout the quran btw), they got it right were the greeks got it right, and wrong where the greeks got it wrong. That's not exactly difficult to explain, or in any way miraculous. That's what happens when you crib from someone else. Just to add to the poster above.

[abtaylor]

Not only did they have access to greek science (and this holds throughout the quran btw), they got it right were the greeks got it right, and wrong where the greeks got it wrong. That's not exactly difficult to explain, or in any way miraculous. That's what happens when you crib from someone else. Just to add to the poster above.

Oh I gotcha

[RobbyPants]

This is their basis for believing in Islam. (Also I should include how they both live in countries where if you denounce Islam or say you don't believe in it, they can basically put you to death. But, that's a different story)

No, that's not true. Their basis for believing it is that they were told it was true when they were young enough to trust everything their parents told them, and now there are strong psychological, cultural, and legal incentives to continue believing. That whole notion that the Koran is highly scientific is just something they bust out to silence the skeptics because they know that saying "I was told this when I was two! It must be true!" or "They'll kill you if you don't believe it! It must be true!" aren't actually compelling arguments.

[Dystopia]

Tell them to shove the Quran up their asses. Debating with irrational people is so frustrating that sometimes telling them to take a híke is the best solution.

[Darinda]

Reminds me of a PZ Meyers debate with a group of Muslim apologists, when PZ showed them that the koran got embryology part wrong, and the apologists used what PZ had to say to claim that even when the koran is wrong it is right.

[JesusHChrist]

And OP, no refutation will matter *one bit* to your debate partner. For the most part, they simple cannot comprehend that something so fundamental to their worldview, such as the Quran, could be wrong. And not just wrong; batshit crazy insane wrong. Wrong, wrong, oh so horribly, wrong.

Try it and see.