[split] Hello everyone

[pocaracas]

Are you for real?

See that thing on the top of the staff?


I hear that's Jesus Christ.
Followers are called christians.
Catholics are followers of Christ, hence are christians. That's it.
Why are you trying to change that extremely simple definition?

Extra points, since you seem to think I use a protestant source:
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religioni_in_Italia (oh, maybe it was the protestants from the US or UK or Germany that wrote this in italian....)
I'm guessing that, if anyone would know if catholics are christians... the italians would be right there on top!


What?

I'm not continuing this.
We are on the intro forum and not exactly allowed to argue about anything in here.
But arguing for the inclusion of catholics as a part of christianity... now there's something I'd never expect...

But you know what? It is never smart to ask sheep if they know where they are going because all they can ever say is 'hither and thither we go," and if you ask the shepherd if he knows where they are going the best he can say is that "hither and thither they must go."

And you know that cross you are pointing at just shows that they left him hanging there like a dirty rag to never be worshiped for sure.

Are you telling me that catholics don't worship that dirty rag?

[LastPoet]

[Minimalist]

You should find this book and read it: Lost Christianities by Bart Ehrman.

You have much to learn Lambert.

Here's a review.

http://www.biblesabbath.org/tss/512/earl...tians.html

The orthodox victors had little interest in preserving the teachings of yet earlier Christians/Christianities which were in disagreement with their doctrine. It would not be helpful to their claims of orthodoxy to admit that they had departed from earlier Christian traditions. In fact, there was an active effort to destroy competing Christian theologies, discredit their leaders, and often, to mischaracterize their teachings. But like a difficult murder mystery where the killer has tried his clever best to cover his tracks, good detective work can often find enough facts and clues to paint the true picture of what happened.

Modern scholars have attempted to do just such a reconstruction of those "lost centuries" between the Primitive Church of the apostles and the emergence of orthodox Christianity of the fourth century. One such scholar is Bart D. Ehrman, Chair of the Department of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. He is widely known and respected in scholarly circles as an authority on the Early Church. He has written many books on the subject and is frequently featured on A&E and the History Channel. I have read several of his books and had the pleasure of meeting him two years ago where he lectured at the Society of Biblical Literature's annual meetings held that year in Denver.

Ehrman's most recent book is Lost Christianities— The Battles for Scripture and the Faiths We Never Knew (Oxford University Press, New York, 2003, $30). His focus is that mystery period of church history during which the cherished faith of the earliest Christians came to be abandoned, destroyed, and forgotten. What can be know of those times? One of Ehrman's purposes is to bring back in view for us moderns what was lost amid the sands of time.

[abaris]

My name is Lambert and this is my first post here. I used to frequent the Internet Infidels and kind of learned what atheist are all about.

So I am a Catholic and I always thought that they never become an atheist but just quit going to church. Does that make sense to anyone here?

Hello!

It doesn't make sense to me, since I was a Catholic. I pretty much turned my back on religion when I was still a child. It didn't interest me and all the services did was bore me to pieces.

I agree that Catholic doctrine is more liberal and flexibel than say evangelical christianity, but it's still the same bible. A book that never made any sense to me.

Anyway, glad to see a catholic made it here. We already have enough evangelicals and it's probably refreshing to get another christian viewpoint.

[Chili]

You should find this book and read it: Lost Christianities by Bart Ehrman.

You have much to learn Lambert.

Here's a review.

http://www.biblesabbath.org/tss/512/earl...tians.html

The orthodox victors had little interest in preserving the teachings of yet earlier Christians/Christianities which were in disagreement with their doctrine. It would not be helpful to their claims of orthodoxy to admit that they had departed from earlier Christian traditions. In fact, there was an active effort to destroy competing Christian theologies, discredit their leaders, and often, to mischaracterize their teachings. But like a difficult murder mystery where the killer has tried his clever best to cover his tracks, good detective work can often find enough facts and clues to paint the true picture of what happened.

Modern scholars have attempted to do just such a reconstruction of those "lost centuries" between the Primitive Church of the apostles and the emergence of orthodox Christianity of the fourth century. One such scholar is Bart D. Ehrman, Chair of the Department of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. He is widely known and respected in scholarly circles as an authority on the Early Church. He has written many books on the subject and is frequently featured on A&E and the History Channel. I have read several of his books and had the pleasure of meeting him two years ago where he lectured at the Society of Biblical Literature's annual meetings held that year in Denver.

Ehrman's most recent book is Lost Christianities— The Battles for Scripture and the Faiths We Never Knew (Oxford University Press, New York, 2003, $30). His focus is that mystery period of church history during which the cherished faith of the earliest Christians came to be abandoned, destroyed, and forgotten. What can be know of those times? One of Ehrman's purposes is to bring back in view for us moderns what was lost amid the sands of time.

Tell Ehrman that God has no grandchildren and so the -ity does not belong to the solitary individual called Christ in his own right. As in a little bit Christian maybe? and Cave dweller still? (and never mind Oxford who do not know the difference or would never publish him).

Then also know that scholars are students for a reason because they just do not know. In Orthodoxy tradition is the teacher wherefore there is a manger in Luke but not in Matthew. So please ask Ehrman what exactly was in Luke's manger that was missing in Matthew to make known the difference between heaven and hell.

To note here is that Luke explains how this movement is axiomatic in LEM as opposed to the rubbish Ehrman was looking at and wrote us about.

[Whateverist]

I've scanned through this thread and must say I remain unclear what point if any you wish to make. You wonder if there really are any atheists rather than simply theists who choose to sleep in on Sunday. You say Catholicism does not fall under the tent of Christianity. I don't know why you think either of these things or what larger point you may be trying to make.

For what difference it makes to your understanding, I am simply someone who does not subscribe to belief in gods. More than that I find the very concept of gods largely incoherent and ill defined. You may decide for yourself if your current concept of atheism is adequate. Certainly what you decide will have no impact on anything of importance to me.

[rexbeccarox]

Mod hat on:

Ok, guys. It's stayed pretty respectful in here so far, but a lot of posts are pushing it. If you'd like to discuss Catholicism vs. Protestantism, or whatever, please start a thread in the appropriate forum.

Thank you. /modhat

[Chili]

But you know what? It is never smart to ask sheep if they know where they are going because all they can ever say is 'hither and thither we go," and if you ask the shepherd if he knows where they are going the best he can say is that "hither and thither they must go."

And you know that cross you are pointing at just shows that they left him hanging there like a dirty rag to never be worshiped for sure.

Are you telling me that catholics don't worship that dirty rag?

Yes I am saying that to the point that Jesus indeed is recognized as a stepping stone to get to the end, and hence the 'dirty' rag image that I present. In other words, the rag must be used, abused and dirty for sure.

Perhaps a better way to put this is to say that Jesus was the placenta of Christ, because after all, if Christ is born where does this Jesus image come from? This would be a good question to ask and then please know that they also call him the second Adam, I am sure you know, and from here it is easy to see that the infancy of Christ is real and that makes Jesus the shield and protector of the Christ-child during the cocoon stage of life that brings renewal to completion in life. So from here we can see the importance of Jesus during what we call the purgation period of life (our Church Suffering) . . . that surely must be left behind lest we become placenta lickers for life and still die nonetheless.

Actually, we are talking Advent here that in Luke and John where natural while in Matthew and Mark that had to beat Jesus purple to at least make him look like a suffering imago at work.

[Minimalist]

Tell Ehrman that God has no grandchildren and so the -ity does not belong to the solitary individual called Christ in his own right. As in a little bit Christian maybe? and Cave dweller still? (and never mind Oxford who do not know the difference or would never publish him).

Okay - so now we know you are just an ignorant catholic. As if there were any other kind.

[rexbeccarox]

Now it's gone beyond. I mean it guys: stop.

Whilst we are generally lenient with insulting language / rudeness in other forums, this kind of behaviour is explicitly disallowed in the Introductions forum. Please welcome new members to the community in a nice manner, or refrain from welcoming them at all.

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