Challenge For Theists

[robvalue]

It's wrong if people are lying about what they can do or are doing.

[emilynghiem]

I believe science can prove this, by measuring the difference in energy and also the effects of healing on schizophrenic patients who no longer are plagued by voices after they go through the treatment. this has significant impact on mental health and criminal justice reform, so it is just a matter of time before medical research catches up with the priests and doctors who have been practicing this already.

Sources: Dr. Scott Peck "Glimpses of the Devil" where he thought it was dark age nonsense also until he took on two cases of schizophrenic patients and found out these methods of diagnosis treatment and cure worked and followed set patterns and stages like curing other diseases.

Pro-tip - just saying words like 'energy' doesn't constitute evidence.

It's all bunk, designed to fool the gullible into subscribing to it in an attempt to fleece them of their money.

There is no evidence for 'spiritual energy' because it doesn't exist. It's nonsense. I hope you've got deep pockets, they'll be a lot lighter by the time you come to actually rely on these 'energies' for healing.

Hi P
The sources I recommend for research are free and only focus on helping as many people as possible as nonprofit volunteers. You are right that the groups seeking money or urging people to join groups are where the fraud occurs and this is dangerous. The conversion therapy by forced torture or the people attacking demons by killing children are some of the worst. The real therapy is completely voluntary in order for the healing to work naturally, it can not be forced because it is based on forgiveness which can never be forced or faked. Forgiveness is a free gift and free choice and cannot be bought or sold. That's the key to healing and recovery of all the methods I've seen ppl use successfully, whether secular or religious.

[dyresand]

You sound like people who think God is already proven so anything else is debunked.

I even have an atheist friend who got rid of demons in his head, real or imagined, by going through spiritual healing deliverance prayer to forgive and heal of past child abuse from two generations back. Real or delusional, those demonic rages are gone and my friend is alive and recovering from drug abuse now.
If this works for people, real or imagined, why not use it so people don't suffer from constant psychosis. At least they have their minds back, and don't fear demonic voices obssessions or rages anymore. What's wrong with therapy if it is voluntary and it works!

Those aren't demons and if someone is hearing a voice or voices in their head they really need medication and help really badly. On the topic of drug abuse and alcohol more or less those people need help too. As far as being abused as a child and all of what you said can be fixed with praying, it.. doesn't work its more or less wishful thinking at best sure if gives you the positive attitude to change but even still you are the one who is doing all the work to change.

[robvalue]

I agree. This kind of fake treatment may stop people getting real help. Sure it may help some people with the placebo effect, but why make up stories just to accomplish that? There's plenty of other ways to get the same effect without being dishonest.

[dyresand]

Honesty is the best policy when dealing with those types of situations because you don't need that person life spiraling down into depression finding out it was all a lie.

[robvalue]

Right. And setting someone up to think this may work could make them worse if it doesn't. Which, quite honestly, I'd be surprised if it did for anyone with serious issues.

So sure, you can blame the person getting treatment for being gullible but I also blame people for being dishonest about what they offer.