Why I never was a Christian in the first place

[Nope]

It amazes me that anyone EVER believed this story, never mind in today.

You have to evaluate it against the overwhelming stupidity and gullibility of jesus freaks to begin with, D-P.

Biggest bunch of assholes going....right next to the allah freaks.

Because asking too many questions or judging their god is considered disrespectful to that god, Christianity prevents its adherents from questioning their faith too deeply.

[Anomalocaris]

I was never a Christian in the first place because I was born in a century that knew better and would tell you if you asked.

[Mr.wizard]

Even if Christianity made sense and was supported by evidence, I still don't think I would be a Christian.

[Drich]

So let me see if I got this straight.
You believe that God sent himself down to earth to become his own son so that he could sacrifice himself to appease his own wrath because it was the only way that he could convince himself to forgive us for being such sinful beings, because blood sacrifice makes everything better because...

because blood, or rather the shedding of it is a physical representation of the spiritual cost God went through to forgive sin.

Well, that part is never explained... but that's not the point. The point is we're sinful beings in need of a savior. The reason we're sinful beings is because an ancestor of mine ate a magic fruit after speaking with a talking snake and that brought "sin" into the world because...

becuase God wanted us to have choice. If their is only God's will then their is no Choice. Sin is the alternative to God's expressed will. It is our option to God's will.

Well, that part isn't explained either... but that's not the point. The point is we should admit we're sinners worthy of Hell because people should be punished for the crimes of their ancestors because...

Ahhh, no. You are seeking attonement for your sin. Not the sins of your fathers.

Well, that part is a little outdated, isn't it... but that's not the point. The point is that Jesus loves you. He loves you so much. And if you don't accept him as your lord he'll torture you for all eternity.

define your use of the word Love. Because the bible use of the word "Agape" agape is about respect, not the feeling you seem to be speaking about. So in your statement replace the word and idea of 'love' with the word respect, and then see how it reads.

Oh dear, that sounds less like love and more like an abusive spouse, doesn't it?

it sounds like someone who paid a great price and demands that one acknoweledge it before they benfit from it.

Well, that's not the point. The point is that Jesus demands worship like a megalomaniac and yet shyly hides behind a curtain instead of taking center stage like such a personality would be expected to. It's almost like some people just made up these rules to suit their agenda to gain more followers with false promises about an afterlife that can't be verified.

Verification is comming brother maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow , but soon and for eternity,

But I shouldn't believe that because the Bible tells me it's all true.

verification of the bible can be found in the full fillment of the promises found in the bible.

If the bible promises abc if you 123, then one can conclude the bible and what it says is true.

This same book tells me the universe operates according to a god that isn't at all subtle or shy. Turn nearly any page and you read about magic, angels and overt displays of divine power that can't be mistaken for natural occurrence or coincidence. And yet when you put the book down, you see a natural universe governed by predictable laws and best understood by science and reason.

what makes you believe that 'science' is not man's attempt to catalog how God does what He does? Then what makes you think just because we can catalog a given principle of God's like say gravity, how does that take away from God putting that principle in place?

And then this same science tells me that we were not poofed into existence in some magic garden 6,000 years ago but evolved from simpler life forms.

again why can't creation and evolution work side by side?

Some Christians accept science and say Genesis is just a metaphor. But if Genesis is a metaphor, when did "the fall" happen? And if there was no "fall", there was nothing for Jesus to save us from. Christianity unravels, such as it ever held together in the first place, either way.

It amazes me that anyone EVER believed this story, never mind in today.

And would someone please explain to me why love becomes evil when the body parts are similar?

Sin and evil are not the same. Homosexuality is a sin because it is sex outside the bounds of a Santified marriage. (Which btw 'love' or your version of it, out side of marriage whether body parts are the same or different are the same sin.)

[Nope]

Well, that part is never explained... but that's not the point. The point is we're sinful beings in need of a savior. The reason we're sinful beings is because an ancestor of mine ate a magic fruit after speaking with a talking snake and that brought "sin" into the world because...

becuase God wanted us to have choice. If their is only God's will then their is no Choice. Sin is the alternative to God's expressed will. It is our option to God's will.

A choice to do what?

Well, that part isn't explained either... but that's not the point. The point is we should admit we're sinners worthy of Hell because people should be punished for the crimes of their ancestors because...

Ahhh, no. You are seeking attonement for your sin. Not the sins of your fathers.[/quote]

But according to your faith, your god made everyone so that they will automatically sin because of the Adam's decision in the garden. So Deist's point stands no matter how much you try to dance around it.

Well, that part is a little outdated, isn't it... but that's not the point. The point is that Jesus loves you. He loves you so much. And if you don't accept him as your lord he'll torture you for all eternity.

define your use of the word Love. Because the bible use of the word "Agape" agape is about respect, not the feeling you seem to be speaking about. So in your statement replace the word and idea of 'love' with the word respect, and then see how it read[/quote]

Jesus respects us so much that we will be tortured for an eternity? How is that better?

Oh dear, that sounds less like love and more like an abusive spouse, doesn't it?

it sounds like someone who paid a great price and demands that one acknoweledge it before they benfit from it./

It sounds like an abusive, sociopathic spouse.

[quote]Well, that's not the point. The point is that Jesus demands worship like a megalomaniac and yet shyly hides behind a curtain instead of taking center stage like such a personality would be expected to. It's almost like some people just made up these rules to suit their agenda to gain more followers with false promises about an afterlife that can't be verified.

Verification is comming brother maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow , but soon and for eternity,

Isn't this like the old saying, The check is in the mail?

By the way, I hope you are doing well, Drich.

[Void]

You believe that God sent himself down to earth to become his own son so that he could sacrifice himself to appease his own wrath because it was the only way that he could convince himself to forgive us for being such sinful beings, because blood sacrifice makes everything better because...

One would think that being omnipotent also included the power to not make mistakes, but it is always the omnipotent gods that screw up.

[Drich]

A choice to do what?

This choice was illustrated perfectly in the garden. As with Adam and Eve we have a choice to either live with God for eternity or to be eternally seperated from Him and creation.

But according to your faith, you god made everyone so that they will automatically sin because of the Adam's decision in the garden. So Deist's point stands no matter how much you try to dance around it.

the reason pal-ie point fails is because God also provided attonemnt . It is the attonement that gives us the ability to choose.

Jesus respects us so much that we will be tortured for an eternity? How is that better?

you do understand the nature of respect right? It is a two way street. Jesus 'respected' you so much he gave you an oppertunity to return this 'respect.'

It sounds like an abusive, sociopathic spouse.

as apposed to what? A spouce who lies cheats and steals from her spouce? If we can't love our 'spouse' properly then our 'spouce' will seek a divorce, forcing us to make our own way apart from Him and His Father's riches and glory. Fore that is what Hell is. It is the absence of God and creation/The Father's glory and riches.

Isn't this like the old saying, The check is in the mail?

By the way, I hope you are doing well, Drich.

The funny thing about that old saying... Sometimes the check is indeed in the mail.

My diagnosis was push back to this Thursday because the 'team' hadn't all reviewed the test results last week.[/quote]

[robvalue]

Very nice takedown. It is by far the most ludicrous, far-fetched and fucked up story I have ever heard.

I was never a christian in the first place because:

(a) I wasn't indoctrinated, one thing I can thank my parents for
(b) Even as a small child I could see it was a pile of shit

I often wonder what would have happened if I was heavily indoctrinated. I feel I am such a logical person that I would have seen through it eventually, or else gone mad from the dissidence. But it's easy for me to say that from my lofty perch of un-poisoned thinking. After a certain point, the indoctrination seems to actually turn into reprogramming of the brain.