130,000 years ago? Even Neandertal Fucks the Creatards

[Funcaldunkal]

I'm actually not surprised, I have heard people suggesting before that Neanderthal's were more intelligent than we give them credit for.

We're talking about a species that survived in the cold, harsh pre-historic European climate for hundreds of thousands of years (probably migrating south during ice ages). It's not surprising at all that they were intelligent enough to do things prehistoric modern humans were also doing. Their upright stature also supports larger brains in the same way ours does.

All modern Europeans also have trace amounts of Neanderthal ancestry too, so they were genetically similar enough to our ancestors to breed with them.

Interesting point. If only we knew more about prehistory. What we do know seems fascinating. Was just recently reading about how the cave paintings in France, the 17,300 year old ones, might be depicting constellations. That's pretty intelligent.

[Exian]

Not to mention they created what classifies as the world's first synthetic material. They created a glue by burning birch bark in a controlled oxygen free fire pit, which allowed it to heat up to the needed temp without actually burning the material. Not too shabby.

[dyresand]

Not to mention they created what classifies as the world's first synthetic material. They created a glue by burning birch bark in a controlled oxygen free fire pit, which allowed it to heat up to the needed temp without actually burning the material. Not too shabby.

 Too bad they all died out it would be interesting to live with both human and neanderthals in this day and age. 

[The Grand Nudger]

We farm grains.  That's what our ag rev was based off of.  Sure, if we look at "farming grains" as the minimum bar then environment played a role.  Thing is, there is no environment capable of supporting us that does not also provide ag opportunity.  None.  Never has been, never could have been, never will be...but that hardly matters, because ag is environmental modification anyway...and if you find a place that "can't ag" - you can make it so.  

Could neandertals have farmed something, in their environment, in their lifetime..sure...but what would the use have been?  Why spend that time?  Even the first ag societies we see were malnourished compared to their nearby brethren who kept on going with hunting and gathering.  There was no reason for -us- to do ag until we exhausted other means.  I doubt that the neandertals, if they understood ag...would have seen it differently than our own ancestors did.

Seems to me they would have been natural ranchers - it's a wonder they didn't go that route.

(it's the soil..btw, in europe...that made it difficult to get ag -as we do it- going, not the cold - people grow tomatoes in alaska..after all, lol. You need a heavy plow. If it weren;t for the damned dirt, cold environments are great - especially for early farmers. Less disease, fewer pests..and the food doesn't go bad as fast on the vine or in the shed. Today...we grow through the winter in florida - for example- for this, and many other reasons.)