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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:04 pm
There are several misconceptions people have about doctors. First of all, they don't all take the Hippocratic Oath. There are various different oaths that different places require, and some have not had an oath that they had to take. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippocratic_Oath
Additionally, the legal obligations of doctors obviously varies by country, but as this story is about the U.S., it is the U.S. law that is relevant:
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionar...+Treatment
There are requirements to help in an emergency (thus, an emergency room in a hospital would not be allowed to refuse treatment for someone in need), but a doctor may ordinarily refuse to take on a new patient if he or she does not want to take on the patient.
And in this case, the baby was seen by another doctor at the time of the original appointment. So even if it were an emergency (it wasn't), it would not be a case of the child being neglected or denied care that was needed.
That said, I think this is a stupid motive to refuse to take a patient.
"A wise man ... proportions his belief to the evidence."
— David Hume, An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding, Section X, Part I.
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:05 pm
(This post was last modified: April 6, 2015 at 3:07 pm by Heywood.)
(April 6, 2015 at 3:00 pm)Norman Humann Wrote: (April 6, 2015 at 2:54 pm)Heywood Wrote: Suppose your child was dying and a doctor did not want to treat the child. Would you put a gun up to the head of the doctor and force them to treat your child? Would forcing the doctor to treat your child be morally okay?
Excuse me? How does this even compare?
No one is holding a gun to the doctors' heads. What is expected of them is simply what is expected from the rest of humanity: to respect basic human rights. Which, FYI, include freedom from discrimination. Don't pretend it's anything else than that. The doctor refused treatment specifically because the parents were lesbians. That's disgusting and unprofessional.
And the doctor refusing to treat a dying child is morally okay, in your opinion?
It comparable because in both situations the doctor is forced to do something against her will.
(April 6, 2015 at 3:04 pm)Pyrrho Wrote: That said, I think this is a stupid motive to refuse to take a patient.
The doctor was being a dick, but she has a right to be a dick if she wants. You people getting butthurt about it isn't a sufficient enough of a reason for the doctors rights to be taken away.
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:07 pm
You're a magnificent humanitarian, woodie. I'm sure fucking jesus is very proud of you.
He seems like a cunt, too.
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:09 pm
(This post was last modified: April 6, 2015 at 3:11 pm by Norman Humann.)
(April 6, 2015 at 3:05 pm)Heywood Wrote: It comparable because in both situations the doctor is forced to do something against her will
Oh, really? Ok, let's see: a girl going to school on Monday despite not wanting to is comparable to her being raped because in both cases she is forced to do something against their will. No, it's not comparable.
Also, nice dodge there. But really, do answer the question. Do you think refusing treatment to a dying child is morally okay? Is it more so than a doctor being forced to do treat someone they don't like?
(April 6, 2015 at 3:05 pm)Heywood Wrote: (April 6, 2015 at 3:04 pm)Pyrrho Wrote: That said, I think this is a stupid motive to refuse to take a patient.
The doctor was being a dick, but she has a right to be a dick if she wants. You people getting butthurt about it isn't a sufficient enough of a reason for the doctors rights to be taken away.
The right to infringe other people's freedoms? Yeah, she doesn't have it.
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:10 pm
(April 6, 2015 at 2:56 pm)Heywood Wrote: Its not a cop out. The doctor has rights and so do the clinic owners.
The doctors rights is not the issue. They shouldn't have the right to refuse patients because of either personal preference or religious views.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:22 pm
Also, whatever happened to the Good Samaritan? Love thy neighbor? Hate the sin, love the sinner?
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:26 pm
All that stopped when christians began cherry picking their bible so it could survive the more civilised future that was dragging them along kicking and screaming
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:46 pm
(April 6, 2015 at 2:34 pm)Heywood Wrote: (April 6, 2015 at 2:15 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: Good old reliable. Defending everyone's right to be an asshole with one side of his mouth, griping about people being assholes in a way he doesn't like with the other.
I imagine he's aware of African Americans dying from lack of care in the USA when last we let healthcare providers pick and choose who they would treat based on to which demographic otherwise unrelated to the provision of medical care the patient belonged. I would like to think that his position is that the slope just isn't THAT slippery any more.
Do you have any evidence to show that African Americans were dying cause doctors would not see them because they were black? If you do, how do you know it was because they were black and not because they were poor and couldn't pay? If you have any evidence to support your claim I would like to see it.
Now if you could convince me that the market isn't going to serve gays then maybe there is a problem that can only be corrected by infringing on the freedom of others. I don't know what challenges the black community faced but I am alive today and simply do not believe a gay person can't easily find a florist, or a photographer, or obtain medical care when they need it. I take the position that before we start limiting peoples individual rights, we need a damn good reason. Preventing butthurt is not a good reason. They are christians. That is a million times more than sufficient reason to crush any "freedom" they might aspire to in their delusional repugnance.
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 3:52 pm
(This post was last modified: April 6, 2015 at 3:56 pm by Heywood.)
(April 6, 2015 at 3:10 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: (April 6, 2015 at 2:56 pm)Heywood Wrote: Its not a cop out. The doctor has rights and so do the clinic owners.
The doctors rights is not the issue. They shouldn't have the right to refuse patients because of either personal preference or religious views.
If there is a second doctor standing right there to serve the patient, why shouldn't the first have the right to refuse for any reason?
You just don't like their behavior and you want to force them to behave in a way you see fit. You really don't care about individual rights or self determination.
(April 6, 2015 at 3:22 pm)Norman Humann Wrote: Also, whatever happened to the Good Samaritan? Love thy neighbor? Hate the sin, love the sinner?
Having lost the argument, Norman wishes to change it into one about religion.
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RE: Pediatrician Refuses Treatment of Baby of Lesbian Parents
April 6, 2015 at 4:08 pm
(April 6, 2015 at 3:52 pm)Heywood Wrote: Having lost the argument, Norman wishes to change it into one about religion.
No, that woman made this about religion. Remember? She refused because Jebus hates gays.
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