Another Good Reason to be a Christian

[robvalue]

Sorry Judi, yes indeed, my comment was for Kitan, I'm sorry I'll edit it to make it clearer. I forgot to write who I was referring to.

[Joods]

No need sweetie. I think he knows it was directed at him.

[robvalue]

It's weird because I'm often "criticised" for not being emotional enough; now I'm too emotional

Oh well. I have a wealth of extremely irrational emotions, but I hope I am aware when they start to affect my judgement. In this case, I've accepted as a fact that Lek has chosen his religion and is sticking to it, at least for now, despite my best efforts to put forward my opinions on why it's not logical.

But I don't want to go around judging who is "right or wrong" or more logical, so if I disagree with someone, I just accept we haven't been able to reach a resolution on that particular point. But I still care about the person as a whole, and I respect their right to hold whatever beliefs they want, no matter how absurd they seem to me. And I'd rather they are happy while holding those beliefs than miserable, because that is nicer for them.

I would say the happiness is real; but that is derived from what I believe to be a misguided source. That's the whole point really, in my opinion Lek cannot differentiate from the happiness that would be caused by his beliefs being true from the happiness in just holding those beliefs and assuming they are true when they are not. That's why relying solely on emotions is not logical.

For all I know, I'm entirely deluded and all the happiness I think I feel in my life is from one massive delusion while I sit dribbling in a hospital. But I want everyone to be as happy as possible, whether their beliefs are true or not. Maybe you could argue that's not logical, but that's just how my morality works. Why would I want them to be miserable as well as "wrong"? I suppose as an incentive to change their views. But it's not my place to try and make them feel bad, that's rather underhanded and relies on me actually being right which is presumptions, to justify.

[Dystopia]

If one value happiness higher than what's probable and is happier while believing in Christianity, then the belief in Christianity is rational. I don't see a problem with it, as long as the person admits it's the "I want it to be true" card.

[Joods]

But I still care about the person as a whole, and I respect their right to hold whatever beliefs they want, no matter how absurd they seem to me. And I'd rather they are happy while holding those beliefs than miserable, because that is nicer for them.

Despite what the religious fanatics want to believe about atheists, a non-religious person can show sincerity and honesty and firmly wish happiness on another. Which is what I believe you are doing. So keep on keeping on because you are fine.

[robvalue]

Thank you Judi, I appreciate it

Emotions and logic are always going to clash at some level, I guess it's up to each person where they draw the line. I don't value truth as so important as to not care at all about other people's emotions. Life is always a compromise.

[Silver]

I apologize for the misunderstanding, Rob.

In no way was I informing you of how to personally feel.

I was simply making a correlation between my understanding of being overly logical and basically being an emotional void as a result.

[robvalue]

That's OK No problem. I'm always happy to be challenged. I hope I have not tried to claim to be 100% logical, I'm well aware I am fallible and I'm always happy for this to be pointed out. And I'm sure some people are way better at logic than me, I'm just some rank amateur who considers himself relatively hard wired for logical thinking. I also have plenty of emotions, which are going to have to interact with logic. I hope I can analyse such interactions well, but there's always room for improvement.

Indeed, if you are nothing but logic, that would logically lead (ahah) to the "robot" scenario. But at some point, you have to decide what is valuable and what is not, to decide what your end goals are. And that is going to depend how you value emotions in this case.

So others may well come to different conclusions, and I don't claim mine to be definitive. I try and own my opinions as much as possible. Apologies if I miss out this part now and again.

I'll share an example of my emotions being irrational. When I even think about certain things, I can get really emotional, to the point of crying, and I don't know why. I can only guess at some sort of link to my childhood. These can be things like the lyrics to "Teddy Bear's Picnic" or the show "Bagpus". I'm welling up with tears just writing this for fucks sake! Even when the story is happy, as in both of these cases, I still feel very mixed emotions and a kind of sadness I cannot identify. It's quite overwhelming. Anything involving animals, or non-human "life" seem to get me the most, although some human stories can get me as well. I wonder if it is my desire to protect innocent and vulnerable creatures, which is so intense as to extend to fictional ones that aren't even in any present "danger".

[Silver]

I genuinely cannot value emotion in relation to how theists view religion making them happy, but that is just me.

[robvalue]

Sure, I respect that. We all value different things to different extents, and there is no right or wrong answer ultimately. We can all just do our best.