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Good morning, RikRik. Top of the mornin' to ya, mate.
I interrupt this thread for a non-urgent question. Ricky, do you ever have doubts about any of it? When other people voice those doubts for you, then you can get thoroughly behind rebutting them. But what happens if no one challenges your assorted definitions and dogmas, do you sometimes doubt any of it yourself?
(August 9, 2015 at 2:51 am)Little Rik Wrote: There is anything thing that really die and disappear in this universe?
If you study physics you should know that nothing die or disappear so why the consciousness
should die and disappear?
By the way the consciousness is not made of matter like the brain so how can something
abstract can be killed?
Uh, yeah, there are things that "really die and disappear." That's why it's called death. Pythagoras... really dead. Cecil the lion... really dead. Plants, animals, and even people really do die (go to a cemetery and try speaking with them if you don't believe me)! Like anything that changes, life and death are a process of change, analogous to buildings that crumble and are there no longer: have you seen the Forum in ancient Rome lately? "Where did it go?" you might ask yourself. Or take memories, which fade and are forever forgotten. Where are they? Yesterday sinks into the oblivion of the past. Can you get that back? No. Why? Because these are all different kinds of death, and have dissolved and changed into other things. Like others have said, the generation and destruction of these various modes of being have nothing to do with the conservation of mass and energy - that is not lost just because the structures they form are. I don't have the slightest clue how it is that abstract objects, or the sensation of being a unique individual, are borne from the mechanisms of a brain, but I see neither reason nor possibility for suggesting that these can persist "out there," in the world, when the only knowledge and experience of them is "in here," and "in here," as in the case of time preceding one's birth, is nowhere, nada, nil.
Quote:Mine is a believe not a claim.
My believe is that there is a very good reason why we can't remember our previous lives.
In this life we find difficult, annoying and frustration to think about our past mistakes and
bad thing that we have done.
At times we just think that would be better if we never done certain things but is too late.
The problem however is that we just can't get rid from our mind these things from the past.
It is a burden to us.
Now just imagine if on the top of our mistakes in this life we also have to deal with mistakes from previous lives and lives before that.
It would be an absolute hell that is why we are prevented from remember anything from previous lives.
Someone understand the problem therefore this entity prevent us from remembering.
What's the difference between a belief and a claim? That we can disregard the former as a statement empty of epistemic content, and symptomatic of ignorance and superstition, while the latter purports to be derived from a sound basis in the facts of experience and supportable by demonstration or testable hypotheses? Okay then, fine, I agree.
Your previous life? Did you drink from the River of Forgetfulness after passing the throne of Lady Necessity and the Plane of Oblivion as in Plato's Myth of Er too?
I'd kiss you if I could
"Every luxury has a deep price. Every indulgence, a cosmic cost. Each fiber of pleasure you experience causes equivalent pain somewhere else. This is the first law of emodynamics [sic]. Joy can be neither created nor destroyed. The balance of happiness is constant.
Fact: Every time you eat a bite of cake, someone gets horsewhipped.
Facter: Every time two people kiss, an orphanage collapses.
Factest: Every time a baby is born, an innocent animal is severely mocked for its physical appearance. Don't be a pleasure hog. Your every smile is a dagger. Happiness is murder.
Vote "yes" on Proposition 1321. Think of some kids. Some kids."
(August 9, 2015 at 2:51 am)Little Rik Wrote: There is anything thing that really die and disappear in this universe?
If you study physics you should know that nothing die or disappear so why the consciousness
should die and disappear?
By the way the consciousness is not made of matter like the brain so how can something
abstract can be killed?
Suns die.
Consciousness is simply a byproduct of brain processes. When the brain dies, the processes cease and the consciousness is no more.
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson
God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers
Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders
Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
(August 9, 2015 at 10:44 am)SnakeOilWarrior Wrote:
(August 9, 2015 at 1:41 am)Little Rik Wrote: Actually the problem is not with listening.
I do listen but i can't hear any one prove me wrong.
Where is the evidence that with the physical death everything is over?
And where is the evidence that the consciousness is a product of the brain?
Is not me that came up with these statements.
It is you guys that keep on saying and repeating at nauseum such a things
therefore it is you that got to come up with evidence.
I listen i listen but there is no evidence forthcoming so don't blame me for not listening.
But no worry mate.
Little bunny still wait for your evidence.
Even when i go to sleep little bunny is awake in case you guys finally decide
to come up with solid evidence regarding your statements.
You can't even keep straight who you're talking to. I never made any of those statements you simpleton. But, when you made the claim that water always joins up to make larger bodies, I pointed out evaporation. You promptly ignored this. When you asked for an instance of rivers not joining oceans, I gave you the Colorado River, dry wash for much of it's last 50 miles or so of riverbed. This too was promptly ignored. You claim we present no evidence when it's you dismissing it out of hand, without consideration. That makes you liar every time you claim "" because you're not.
You are very funny Snake.
Evaporation is a temporary brake for the water to end up in the ocean.
Sooner or later the clouds will piss down again and guess what?
That water that evaporate and form the clouds will at the end end up in the ocean anyway.
The same thing will happen for your river.
In part the water evaporate, in part may well sink down under the ground and end up in the ocean
anyway so where is your evidence that not all the time water end up in the ocean?
By the way you well may keep that liar for yourself.
Have a good day Snake.
(August 9, 2015 at 2:51 am)Little Rik Wrote: There is anything thing that really die and disappear in this universe?
If you study physics you should know that nothing die or disappear so why the consciousness
should die and disappear?
By the way the consciousness is not made of matter like the brain so how can something
abstract can be killed?
Quote:Suns die.
Sure, all bodies die sooner or later.
But who really die?
Have you got any solid evidence that the energy die as well?
Have you got any evidence that energy doesn't go hand in hand with consciousness?
Let us see this evidence IAT.
In the meantime my suggestion is to avoid make statements like this until you got solid evidence
to the contrary.
Quote:Consciousness is simply a byproduct of brain processes. When the brain dies, the processes cease and the consciousness is no more.
One more guessing IAT.
Didn't i suggest you to come up with evidence to the contrary before you state your guessing?
Have a good day.
(August 9, 2015 at 11:21 am)Whateverist the White Wrote: Good morning, RikRik. Top of the mornin' to ya, mate.
I interrupt this thread for a non-urgent question. Ricky, do you ever have doubts about any of it? When other people voice those doubts for you, then you can get thoroughly behind rebutting them. But what happens if no one challenges your assorted definitions and dogmas, do you sometimes doubt any of it yourself?
What if I'm wrong? I can ask that. Can you?
Life is full of doubts.
I don't know if i will be alive or not in the next few minutes.
A plane can fall on my house and kill me so i could not finish this post and you will never know
Little Rik answer.
Just imagine how sad would be.
I am sure you will cry for days on hand Whatever.
Would you?
(August 10, 2015 at 3:32 am)Little Rik Wrote: Sure, all bodies die sooner or later.
But who really die?
Have you got any solid evidence that the energy die as well?
Have you got any evidence that energy doesn't go hand in hand with consciousness?
Let us see this evidence IAT.
In the meantime my suggestion is to avoid make statements like this until you got solid evidence
to the contrary.
One more guessing IAT.
Didn't i suggest you to come up with evidence to the contrary before you state your guessing?
Have a good day.
Dude you are the one making the positive claim that "energy goes hand in hand with consciousness". Once you say that, if you want other people to believe it, YOU must provide the evidence that that is the case!
Because as everyone has said a thousand times here, there is NO evidence of a consciousness existing outside of a brain!
Since you don't appear to understand how the burden of proof works, I'll make it very simple:
Suppose we're standing face to face, and I tell you that I have 500€ in my pocket. You don't necessarily believe me, and ask me to show you those 500€.
Now, I can do two things:
1. Show you the 500€, you believe me and we go on with our lives
2. Tell you that you have no evidence that I DON'T have those 500€, raise my middle finger and continue acting like I actually have those 500€.
See the difference?
"Every luxury has a deep price. Every indulgence, a cosmic cost. Each fiber of pleasure you experience causes equivalent pain somewhere else. This is the first law of emodynamics [sic]. Joy can be neither created nor destroyed. The balance of happiness is constant.
Fact: Every time you eat a bite of cake, someone gets horsewhipped.
Facter: Every time two people kiss, an orphanage collapses.
Factest: Every time a baby is born, an innocent animal is severely mocked for its physical appearance. Don't be a pleasure hog. Your every smile is a dagger. Happiness is murder.
Vote "yes" on Proposition 1321. Think of some kids. Some kids."
August 10, 2015 at 3:53 am (This post was last modified: August 10, 2015 at 3:54 am by Homeless Nutter.)
lol
Trying to teach Little pRik science is like trying to wipe sh*t off of a dog-turd...
"The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one." - George Bernard Shaw
"Every luxury has a deep price. Every indulgence, a cosmic cost. Each fiber of pleasure you experience causes equivalent pain somewhere else. This is the first law of emodynamics [sic]. Joy can be neither created nor destroyed. The balance of happiness is constant.
Fact: Every time you eat a bite of cake, someone gets horsewhipped.
Facter: Every time two people kiss, an orphanage collapses.
Factest: Every time a baby is born, an innocent animal is severely mocked for its physical appearance. Don't be a pleasure hog. Your every smile is a dagger. Happiness is murder.
Vote "yes" on Proposition 1321. Think of some kids. Some kids."
(August 9, 2015 at 2:51 am)Little Rik Wrote: There is anything thing that really die and disappear in this universe?
If you study physics you should know that nothing die or disappear so why the consciousness
should die and disappear?
By the way the consciousness is not made of matter like the brain so how can something
abstract can be killed?
Quote:Uh, yeah, there are things that "really die and disappear." That's why it's called death. Pythagoras... really dead. Cecil the lion... really dead. Plants, animals, and even people really do die (go to a cemetery and try speaking with them if you don't believe me)! Like anything that changes, life and death are a process of change, analogous to buildings that crumble and are there no longer: have you seen the Forum in ancient Rome lately? "Where did it go?" you might ask yourself. Or take memories, which fade and are forever forgotten. Where are they? Yesterday sinks into the oblivion of the past. Can you get that back? No. Why? Because these are all different kinds of death, and have dissolved and changed into other things. Like others have said, the generation and destruction of these various modes of being have nothing to do with the conservation of mass and energy - that is not lost just because the structures they form are. I don't have the slightest clue how it is that abstract objects, or the sensation of being a unique individual, are borne from the mechanisms of a brain, but I see neither reason nor possibility for suggesting that these can persist "out there," in the world, when the only knowledge and experience of them is "in here," and "in here," as in the case of time preceding one's birth, is nowhere, nada, nil.
You are making a hell of a confusion mate.
All your points are build on guessing and guessing alone.
Physical death is no evidence that YOU die.
First of all you should consider that body-brain and consciousness
can be separate and will separate as soon as the parallelism between
body and consciousness is over.
If you go along with the theory that when the body die is all over then
you may well think that when your car rot away you rot away as well.
This sort of believes belong to the stone age not to this age of knowledge.
Quote:Mine is a believe not a claim.
My believe is that there is a very good reason why we can't remember our previous lives.
In this life we find difficult, annoying and frustration to think about our past mistakes and
bad thing that we have done.
At times we just think that would be better if we never done certain things but is too late.
The problem however is that we just can't get rid from our mind these things from the past.
It is a burden to us.
Now just imagine if on the top of our mistakes in this life we also have to deal with mistakes from previous lives and lives before that.
It would be an absolute hell that is why we are prevented from remember anything from previous lives.
Someone understand the problem therefore this entity prevent us from remembering.
Quote:What's the difference between a belief and a claim? That we can disregard the former as a statement empty of epistemic content, and symptomatic of ignorance and superstition, while the latter purports to be derived from a sound basis in the facts of experience and supportable by demonstration or testable hypotheses? Okay then, fine, I agree.
Your previous life? Did you drink from the River of Forgetfulness after passing the throne of Lady Necessity and the Plane of Oblivion as in Plato's Myth of Er too?
My believes are based on results.
Suppose someone tell you......IF YOU DO SUCH A THING YOU WILL GET SUCH RESULT.
I did that thing and i got that result so i believe that by doing that thing the result will be
as was indicated to me.
Why i do not do the claim then?
Because the matter in question is not physical where the evidence must be physical.
Here we are in the real of spirituality and the evidence obviously is not physical.
Atheism is based on matter but matter has really nothing to do with something much
higher and more subtle.
