Test my belief system

[robvalue]

Is? Is is just one those words which has to be used while defining itself. Is is the state something is in

[MTL]

robvalue can answer for himself, but the distinguishing characteristic of ignosticism is the idea that the term "god" is meaningless.  Therefore, saying "god exists" is like saying "sdfadsafdjsl exits."  In other words, it is not really saying anything. 

A standard agnostic is someone who does not say that the term "god" is meaningless, but says that he or she does not know whether god exists or not.  The ignostic says that the question of "god's" existence is meaningless and therefore nothing is being asked when one utters, "does god exist?"

To give more details, to the question "Does god exist?"

Theist: Yes.

Agnostic:   I don't know.

Weak atheist:  I do not believe god exists (and do not believe god does not exist).  (The weak atheist simply does not believe the statement "god exists" and does not affirm that god does not exist.)

Strong atheist: No.

Ignostic:  Your question is meaningless.


As you can see from the link to ignosticism, there is some dispute over whether ignosticism is compatible with agnosticism or some form of atheism.  Also, an ignostic may simply say he or she is an atheist when asked such things, to avoid having to explain his or her position and to give a simple answer that gives at least an approximation of their position (that is, it is more akin to atheism than theism).

Bold Mine:

This is where I was getting confused because it seems like a person could be both.

I'm sorta both.

I identify as Agnostic because I am willing to use the term "god" very loosely,
because it has a colloquial definition, if nothing else.

However, if pressed, I will readily agree with Ignostics that the definition is technically non-existent.

[henryp]

Erm....

I try and treat animals and humans nicely, I'm not sure how you got from there to godlike. I'm not proposing forcing anyone to do anything I say. These are my personal beliefs. Where did I say I wanted to make this the rule for everybody? This isn't a manifesto for running a country.

Killing doctors? How is what I said anything like that? I do my best to reduce the harm I do. It seems there has been a major misunderstanding.

Read #7 in your original post.

[Mr.wizard]

Bold Mine:

This is where I was getting confused because it seems like a person could be both.

I'm sorta both.

I identify as Agnostic because I am willing to use the term "god" very loosely,
because it has a colloquial definition, if nothing else.

However, if pressed, I will readily agree with Ignostics that the definition is technically non-existent.

I would say that I am both as well, because I think some concepts of god are better defined than others.

[Longhorn]

I'm sorta both.

I identify as Agnostic because I am willing to use the term "god" very loosely,
because it has a colloquial definition, if nothing else.

However, if pressed, I will readily agree with Ignostics that the definition is technically non-existent.

I would say that I am both as well, because I think some concepts of god are better defined than others.

Me three!

[Aoi Magi]

1) I am a sceptic. (I try to only believe things when there is a good reason to do so. The degree to which I apply my scepticism depends on both the extraordinary nature of the claim, and the importance.)

Why use "sceptic" instead of "skeptic"?

2) I am an ignostic atheist. (I do not have a belief in "God", and further I feel the question as generally asked is meaningless since there is no unambiguous definition of "God". I can't believe in something when I don't even know what it is.)

Why bother with such labels? For general theists, the term "atheist" is enough to start picturing a demonic spawn-of-evil

3) I do not claim that anything I say is certainly correct, nor do I claim to know everything. "I don't know" is a perfectly valid answer. I can speculate, but I'm aware that is what I am doing.

How far can you "speculate" towards the existence of yahweh from OT?

4) My morality is based on evaluating the consequences of my actions. I weigh the likely benefit to humans, animals and the environment against the likely costs. No other definition of morality matters to me. My answer to any moral question may be that it's very complex and I'd have to consider all angles. I don't have instant answers to everything.

Do you actually weigh the consequences of all your actions?

5) As far as I know, life has no inherent purpose. Instead, we decide our own purpose and make the best use of our lives as we see fit. The happiness and suffering of those in the here and now is enough to give it a real purpose to me.

so what is your purpose?

6) I try to use logic as much as possible, and to avoid superstition. I am human though and I make mistakes. I try to make as few unecessary assumptions as possible.

How good are you at chess?

7) I believe in people and animals being treated as fairly as possible, regardless of their particular attributes or personal choices. Of course some choices to harm others must be met with removal from general society in order to prevent further harm to others.

How do you determine what's fair?

[robvalue]

Wallym:

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I still don't know what your objection is. #7 is saying that I want people to be as unrestricted as possible to do what they want to do, while acknowledging that there are going to be limits. If someone is actively harming people, I understand that society can't "support this personal choice". The wellbeing of society gets put first in such cases. Again, this is just my personal view, this is not a manifesto. I'm not suggesting that I personally make the decisions or the standards. I'm simply saying I support the notion of equality and fairness. I'm sorry if you found my original wording unclear.

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Magi: Thanks for your questions

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1) I'm in England, and sceptic is the correct UK English (original) spelling as far as I'm aware America had to be all different and screw up the spelling of loads of words.

2) Yes, in general conversation atheist is more than sufficient to cause plenty of misunderstanding. I only went into detail here as it's an atheist forum where people have more chance of understanding the particulars.

3) Yahweh is a mess of contradictions, so for him to exist literally as written in the OT is impossible unless our understanding of logic as applied to reality is wrong. I'd say the probability of a being that existed being even remotely similar to Yahweh is negligible.

4) I weigh the consequences of my actions as much as possible, but there isn't time for a full analysis before every single action. I try to shortlist decisions which are likely to be morally less obvious, or carry greater impact, and devote more time to thinking about those. Most decisions seem to be either unimportant or obvious, after years of experience. I also try to be reflective and to look for evidence of the impact of all my actions in general. If I notice that something I thought was a good idea is actually causing some harm for example, even something I thought was obvious, I'd stop and rethink it.

5) My purpose, as designated by myself, is to try to help people and animals to be happy and healthy where possible, so they can enjoy their lives. Ironically my purpose is also to minimise the harm my mere continued existence causes on humans and animals. I'm dedicated in particular to looking after my wife and my pets, as my actions have the most direct impact on them. And while doing all this, I try to enjoy myself too!

6) I'm pretty good at chess. I used to play for a chess team when I was younger, going around the county playing other teams. I was in our second team, we had some players way better than me in the first team.

7) Determining what's fair is a very complex question! I look at it as trying to remove all unnecessary barriers, prejudices and harm. I want to see humans and animals given the chance to be happy and healthy, and for this not to be infringed upon by irrelevant details. I would like society to look after everyone as a whole, to see where any unnecessary harm is happening and to try and stop it. I support policies which discourage people from imposing their personal prejudices onto others in a way that impedes their ability to get opportunities (such as employment) as far as is reasonably possible. This is a huge subject and this response is rather inadequate, I'm sure. Fairness I would see as closely tied to morality, in this case the general morality that society can hopefully agree on. My personal idea of what is fair and what is not is something that is always developing, because there are so many variables involved.

I hope these answers were somewhat useful, feel free to follow up

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[ErGingerbreadMandude]

1. Every life has a fundamental purpose.
2. If you think the question "Do you believe in God?" is meaningless.Which answer do you think is most illogical to the question - Yes or No?


Yeah,that's about the only problem i found in first glance

[robvalue]

1. What purpose is this? When I say life has no apparent inherent purpose, I mean from the perspective of a neutral universe / an ”outsider". Purpose implies to me some sort of intended overall goal. Of course we can analyse how things work and attribute our own purpose to anything we like. But "purpose" is an abstract judgement, not a quality inherent to things themselves. That's my intended point Of course we can debate what the definition of "purpose" is. But I meant it to be as part of some sort of intended goal.

If however we turn out to be a computer simulation, life as we view it could be viewed as having an inherent/external purpose, that being completing a program. Whether that program has any purpose itself is another matter, I refer only to our reality for the moment.

2. Saying yes, that you do believe in something while not understanding the question, is most illogical in my opinion. By saying no, you're not saying you believe such a thing does not exist, you're saying you don't believe it does exist. From this point of view, weak atheism makes the most sense while "God" remains undefined.

[ErGingerbreadMandude]

1. The most fundamental purpose of life is to survive.

2. I'll leave you alone on this point because i love you.