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Facing a dilemma
#51
RE: Facing a dilemma
... and as has been pointed out, molestation is not a behavior that goes away.

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#52
RE: Facing a dilemma
(September 22, 2015 at 12:04 pm)pocaracas Wrote: You're already reliving it, ever since you first heard about the reopening of the case, so it's not the telling the tale in court that will change much, is it?

I agree, but that seems neither here nor there if I'm understanding KP's decision right now - that he is willing to participate.

Quote:this man, now in his 60's or 70's, has had his life, he's almost ready to meet his maker... he's probably not fit to harm anyone else in society...

People in their 60s and 70s can be quite active and very capable of committing crimes such as poisoning or child molestation. Undecided

Quote:Did he do that thing again? Is he a danger to society? Is he likely to repeat that behavior?

It's not just a matter of whether he went on to murder anyone else, though, but whether he continued on to molest or abuse other children, and if, in fact, he's continuing to do so today.  KP didn't share information pertaining to that possibility and, as presented, it seems that he's only being pursued for crimes committed decades ago so we can only speculate on what else this man might have been doing that no one has come forward to report about.

Quote:Is it justice to lock him up?

Potentially, yes.  Possibly, no.

It might be important for KP and his family to have a discussion among themselves about what kind of justice they are seeking.  I do think, however, that crimes such as these should not go unpunished in some way; it sets a dangerous precedent to allow a murderer or child molester to "get away with it" because they are deemed too old for a punishment such as jail time to have any real meaning.
Teenaged X-Files obsession + Bermuda Triangle episode + Self-led school research project = Atheist.
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#53
RE: Facing a dilemma
(September 22, 2015 at 12:09 pm)lkingpinl Wrote: This was precisely how I felt.  It seemed like vengeance and not justice. But I reason it like this.  This man broke the law and took advantage of three innocent kids.  He was never served his day in court for a multitude of reasons.  Justice was never given an opportunity to be served.  Though yes, I personally forgave him, others who were harmed directly or indirectly by his actions have not and have not seen the justice system given an opportunity to serve its purpose.  Their motives may indeed be vengeance, but it can still be classified as justice.

Sure it can be classified as justice... it is justice.
But is it justice worth doing?
Is the reason for this justice simply vengeance?

Is punishing this person, now, going to prevent harm to anyone?

I'd say that, at this stage, it's far more significant if you can get this guy to meet with the family and have him apologize to everyone he's wronged... to show repentance.
The court procedure doesn't encourage this... and it seems to me that this is what your family needs.
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#54
RE: Facing a dilemma
(September 22, 2015 at 12:09 pm)lkingpinl Wrote: This was precisely how I felt.  It seemed like vengeance and not justice. But I reason it like this.  This man broke the law and took advantage of three innocent kids.  He was never served his day in court for a multitude of reasons.  Justice was never given an opportunity to be served.  Though yes, I personally forgave him, others who were harmed directly or indirectly by his actions have not and have not seen the justice system given an opportunity to serve its purpose.  Their motives may indeed be vengeance, but it can still be classified as justice.

There's a reason crimes like this have no statute of limitations. That's because the crimes are so egregious that it's always in the interest of justice to see that the perpetrator pay for them. Even if the man was 110, it is fitting that he die in a prison cell.

Besides, he's not so old that he can't do this to someone else.
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
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#55
RE: Facing a dilemma
(September 22, 2015 at 12:24 pm)pocaracas Wrote:
(September 22, 2015 at 12:09 pm)lkingpinl Wrote: This was precisely how I felt.  It seemed like vengeance and not justice. But I reason it like this.  This man broke the law and took advantage of three innocent kids.  He was never served his day in court for a multitude of reasons.  Justice was never given an opportunity to be served.  Though yes, I personally forgave him, others who were harmed directly or indirectly by his actions have not and have not seen the justice system given an opportunity to serve its purpose.  Their motives may indeed be vengeance, but it can still be classified as justice.

Sure it can be classified as justice... it is justice.
But is it justice worth doing?
Is the reason for this justice simply vengeance?

Is punishing this person, now, going to prevent harm to anyone?

I'd say that, at this stage, it's far more significant if you can get this guy to meet with the family and have him apologize to everyone he's wronged... to show repentance.
The court procedure doesn't encourage this... and it seems to me that this is what your family needs.

While I agree with you, if that were to happen, I assure you my grandfather would be one serving jail time because he would murder him.  My grandfather is a hard hearted individual who has been in prison before and would not hesitate to take this man out personally.
We are not made happy by what we acquire but by what we appreciate.
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#56
RE: Facing a dilemma
It's not just about preventing harm. It's righting a wrong. This guy got away, literally, with murder. He was allowed to live the best years of his life in freedom precisely because he intimidated those that could put him away. There's a chance to rectify that. That the person is now older should have no bearing on whether or not they go to prison, IMO.
"I was thirsty for everything, but blood wasn't my style" - Live, "Voodoo Lady"
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#57
RE: Facing a dilemma
What is the justice system for?
Revenge?
or Correction?
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#58
RE: Facing a dilemma
(September 22, 2015 at 12:24 pm)pocaracas Wrote: Is punishing this person, now, going to prevent harm to anyone?

Potentially, yes.
Teenaged X-Files obsession + Bermuda Triangle episode + Self-led school research project = Atheist.
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#59
RE: Facing a dilemma
(September 21, 2015 at 9:42 pm)lkingpinl Wrote:
(September 21, 2015 at 9:36 pm)ignoramus Wrote: Wow king!  I must say you've come through with shining colours considering what you've been through. If I may, can the arsenic in her body have been put there any other way? Eg, medicines, etc? In other words, is there any doubt as to how it got there in your mind? Good luck man...

No the coroner report showed that the levels were 10x the normal amount in a human body and concluded that it was probably administered slowly over time and was the cause of her body degrading (not MS). He ruled it a homicide

Have you or your siblings had your own arsenic levels checked?  Did you get the same spice?
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#60
RE: Facing a dilemma
(September 22, 2015 at 12:27 pm)lkingpinl Wrote: While I agree with you, if that were to happen, I assure you my grandfather would be one serving jail time because he would murder him.  My grandfather is a hard hearted individual who has been in prison before and would not hesitate to take this man out personally.

hmmmm better do it on neutral ground, then!
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