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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 13, 2015 at 3:03 pm
(This post was last modified: November 13, 2015 at 3:32 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 12, 2015 at 1:39 pm)Lek Wrote: It doesn't matter a bit if the date of celebration has pagan roots or isn't when Jesus was actually born. What matters is what it means to people who celebrate it today.
I know right, and so those people should know that they aren't celebrating christmas for the reasons it was established, so they might live more accordingly to their religious traditions.
"Yeah rhythm, this commercial culture" -nope, not even remotely the subject.
The idea behind reappropriating pagan holidays was to reduce the amount of evil juju in the air, to make the days holy by celebrating them, and thusly reduce whatever fraction of "unholy" this-and-that's might be flitting around - in order for the society to garner favor from god and avoid his righteous punishment on the collective. That's what christmas is about, warding off evil. Christmas has nothing to do with christ, never did, still doesn't. Ironically, christmas as it stands today (and then) has nothing to do with paganism either. It's just an example of the larger narrative of superstitions which have outlived our memories regarding their establishment.
OFC most christians don't believe in goblins anymore, and if they thought that their holiday was magical protection against trolls they might feel a little silly.........but they like the party...so now it's "about jesus" - or something like that...........despite having nothing to do with jesus - and that's not silly, apparently. Christians, nowadays, seem to be suckers for any excuse for a party. They used to keep us safe from goblins and trolls....and I can't help but feel that the quality of their service has declined the past few centuries, if the best they've got today is some shit about a manger and a cup of eggnog. Who's covering the troll situation, should I be alarmed?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 13, 2015 at 7:02 pm
(November 13, 2015 at 2:58 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: I've got a burning Yule log I need to stick somewhere.
Burning isn't a good sign 
I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 13, 2015 at 7:19 pm
(November 13, 2015 at 7:02 pm)Spooky Wrote: (November 13, 2015 at 2:58 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: I've got a burning Yule log I need to stick somewhere.
Burning isn't a good sign
That depends on intent.
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 14, 2015 at 3:03 pm
(November 13, 2015 at 3:03 pm)Rhythm Wrote: (November 12, 2015 at 1:39 pm)Lek Wrote: It doesn't matter a bit if the date of celebration has pagan roots or isn't when Jesus was actually born. What matters is what it means to people who celebrate it today.
I know right, and so those people should know that they aren't celebrating christmas for the reasons it was established, so they might live more accordingly to their religious traditions.
"Yeah rhythm, this commercial culture" -nope, not even remotely the subject.
The idea behind reappropriating pagan holidays was to reduce the amount of evil juju in the air, to make the days holy by celebrating them, and thusly reduce whatever fraction of "unholy" this-and-that's might be flitting around - in order for the society to garner favor from god and avoid his righteous punishment on the collective. That's what christmas is about, warding off evil. Christmas has nothing to do with christ, never did, still doesn't. Ironically, christmas as it stands today (and then) has nothing to do with paganism either. It's just an example of the larger narrative of superstitions which have outlived our memories regarding their establishment.
OFC most christians don't believe in goblins anymore, and if they thought that their holiday was magical protection against trolls they might feel a little silly.........but they like the party...so now it's "about jesus" - or something like that...........despite having nothing to do with jesus - and that's not silly, apparently. Christians, nowadays, seem to be suckers for any excuse for a party. They used to keep us safe from goblins and trolls....and I can't help but feel that the quality of their service has declined the past few centuries, if the best they've got today is some shit about a manger and a cup of eggnog. Who's covering the troll situation, should I be alarmed?
No. You're wrong Rhythm. The Christmas holiday was created to turn the winter solstice into a christian holy day for christians, and was created in order to give the winter solstice holiday a special meaning for them. For christians it has always been a celebration of Christ's birth. No christians are celebrating Christmas to honor it's pagan roots. It doesn't matter a whit to me what the pagans celebrated on that date. When you celebrate Christmas are you honoring a pagan belief?
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 14, 2015 at 3:32 pm
(November 14, 2015 at 3:03 pm)Lek Wrote: No. You're wrong Rhythm. The Christmas holiday was created to turn the winter solstice into a christian holy day for christians, and was created in order to give the winter solstice holiday a special meaning for them. For christians it has always been a celebration of Christ's birth. No christians are celebrating Christmas to honor it's pagan roots. It doesn't matter a whit to me what the pagans celebrated on that date. When you celebrate Christmas are you honoring a pagan belief?
When I as an Atheist celebrate christmas, it's to honor the social convention. I'm not honoring a pagan belief, nor any kind of "Belief". And quite frankly, christmas in its current state really isn't about christ, christianity or any of the above.
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 14, 2015 at 3:54 pm
(This post was last modified: November 14, 2015 at 3:56 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 14, 2015 at 3:03 pm)Lek Wrote: No. You're wrong Rhythm. The Christmas holiday was created to turn the winter solstice into a christian holy day for christians, and was created in order to give the winter solstice holiday a special meaning for them. For christians it has always been a celebration of Christ's birth. No christians are celebrating Christmas to honor it's pagan roots. It doesn't matter a whit to me what the pagans celebrated on that date. When you celebrate Christmas are you honoring a pagan belief?
No...., I'm not, but don't take my word for it, google is your friend. Yes, christmas is a way of christianizing the winter solstice - as I said. No, they aren't honoring any pagan roots - as I said. I'm not sure why you think you're disagreeing with me. Is it the motive of the early church that bothers you, why they christianized the solstice? Tough titties, take it up with them.
.............?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 14, 2015 at 4:21 pm
(This post was last modified: November 14, 2015 at 4:22 pm by Lek.)
(November 14, 2015 at 3:54 pm)Rhythm Wrote: No...., I'm not, but don't take my word for it, google is your friend. Yes, christmas is a way of christianizing the winter solstice - as I said. No, they aren't honoring any pagan roots - as I said. I'm not sure why you think you're disagreeing with me. Is it the motive of the early church that bothers you, why they christianized the solstice? Tough titties, take it up with them.
.............? From your post:
'The idea behind reappropriating pagan holidays was to reduce the amount of evil juju in the air, to make the days holy by celebrating them, and thusly reduce whatever fraction of "unholy" this-and-that's might be flitting around - in order for the society to garner favor from god and avoid his righteous punishment on the collective. That's what christmas is about, warding off evil. Christmas has nothing to do with christ, never did, still doesn't. Ironically, christmas as it stands today (and then) has nothing to do with paganism either. It's just an example of the larger narrative of superstitions which have outlived our memories regarding their establishment.'
This is what I disagree with you about.
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 14, 2015 at 4:24 pm
(This post was last modified: November 14, 2015 at 4:25 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Too bad, because that's why they christianized pagan holidays. Like I said, you'd have to take it up with them, and it has nothing to do with me, that today...you, as a christian, find the idea to be absurd. Of course it was.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 14, 2015 at 4:27 pm
(This post was last modified: November 14, 2015 at 4:29 pm by jenny1972.)
(November 14, 2015 at 3:03 pm)Lek Wrote: (November 13, 2015 at 3:03 pm)Rhythm Wrote: I know right, and so those people should know that they aren't celebrating christmas for the reasons it was established, so they might live more accordingly to their religious traditions.
"Yeah rhythm, this commercial culture" -nope, not even remotely the subject.
The idea behind reappropriating pagan holidays was to reduce the amount of evil juju in the air, to make the days holy by celebrating them, and thusly reduce whatever fraction of "unholy" this-and-that's might be flitting around - in order for the society to garner favor from god and avoid his righteous punishment on the collective. That's what christmas is about, warding off evil. Christmas has nothing to do with christ, never did, still doesn't. Ironically, christmas as it stands today (and then) has nothing to do with paganism either. It's just an example of the larger narrative of superstitions which have outlived our memories regarding their establishment.
OFC most christians don't believe in goblins anymore, and if they thought that their holiday was magical protection against trolls they might feel a little silly.........but they like the party...so now it's "about jesus" - or something like that...........despite having nothing to do with jesus - and that's not silly, apparently. Christians, nowadays, seem to be suckers for any excuse for a party. They used to keep us safe from goblins and trolls....and I can't help but feel that the quality of their service has declined the past few centuries, if the best they've got today is some shit about a manger and a cup of eggnog. Who's covering the troll situation, should I be alarmed?
No. You're wrong Rhythm. The Christmas holiday was created to turn the winter solstice into a christian holy day for christians, and was created in order to give the winter solstice holiday a special meaning for them. For christians it has always been a celebration of Christ's birth. No christians are celebrating Christmas to honor it's pagan roots. It doesn't matter a whit to me what the pagans celebrated on that date. When you celebrate Christmas are you honoring a pagan belief?
so Santa Clause coming to give kids presents is related to jesus how? its a fun holiday for kids and i loved any holiday that involved me getting things im sure i always loved it but how is it christian and you believe jesus was born on december 25 ?
Imagine there's no heaven It's easy if you try No hell below us Above us only sky Imagine all the people Living for today  Imagine there's no countries It isn't hard to do Nothing to kill or die for And no religion too Imagine all the people Living life in peace You may say I'm a dreamer But I'm not the only one I hope someday you will join us And the world will be as one - John Lennon
The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also - Mark Twain
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RE: Curious question of curiosity.
November 14, 2015 at 4:44 pm
(November 14, 2015 at 4:27 pm)jenny1972 Wrote: (November 14, 2015 at 3:03 pm)Lek Wrote: No. You're wrong Rhythm. The Christmas holiday was created to turn the winter solstice into a christian holy day for christians, and was created in order to give the winter solstice holiday a special meaning for them. For christians it has always been a celebration of Christ's birth. No christians are celebrating Christmas to honor it's pagan roots. It doesn't matter a whit to me what the pagans celebrated on that date. When you celebrate Christmas are you honoring a pagan belief?
so Santa Clause coming to give kids presents is related to jesus how? its a fun holiday for kids and i loved any holiday that involved me getting things im sure i always loved it but how is it christian and you believe jesus was born on december 25 ?
Are you kidding me? Millions of christians around the world celebrate christmas as the birth of Christ. Are you saying that santa claus is the only meaning of christmas for christians? I don't believe Jesus was born on Dec 25. I also don't believe Washington and Lincoln were born on presidents day.
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