EU: Should the UK Leave or Stay?

[account_inactive]

The EU is a little different compared to the US, but yeah I doubt that he was being sarcastic. It's early morning here so he will probably be on shortly.

Thanks and good looking out Bella 

It's nearly 4am here and I'm on my 5th whisky.

Sounds like you're having fun.  

[Goosebump]

Similarly, I think David Cameron is an untrustworthy piece of shit, and I'd never vote for having him in power. But that has no effect on whether or not leaving the EU is a good idea.

I don't know what I would class myself as politically. But I don't particularly like David Cameron either, he's never followed any of his promises. He couldn't give a shit about our citizens (hence our NHS and welfare system going down the bloody drain).

I don't think any politician in parliament is fit to lead the country at all. We need a strong leader who cares about the citizens and doesn't fuck about. We also need someone who doesn't want to just lick the US's arse all the time.

I'd also add that political systems are very nuanced and the voting populace tends to only get behind one big guy or another big guy. But there are a lot of little guys out there in more local systems that should be looked at with as much if not more scrutiny then the "big" contenders.

I believe the old cliche that all politics is local. If you don't get in good people on your local level then you won't have a good crop for the higher levels. People need to get off the big election cycles, where often they treat their opinions as if they were facts, and get fully invested in all the local candidates that present more often and are all too often neglected.

[Goosebump]

Thanks and good looking out Bella 

It's nearly 4am here and I'm on my 5th whisky.

Sounds like you're having fun.  

I just don't want it to be at anyone expense. So I'm grateful that you set me strait.

[robvalue]

Yeah, I don't know who is best to run the country either. I think the Tories are still ultimately interested in keeping the rich rich and the poor poor. I think it's about time someone else got a shot.

I'm personally behind a lot of the policies of the Green Party, which is why I vote for them to raise their profile and those policies. Even if they don't have a chance of winning yet, and some of their policies need "refinement" shall we say, I want those matters to become part of people's considerations. I want other parties to take those issues seriously, so I want green in contention.

Animal policies are particularly important to me, and tories are the worst for this, followed by UKIP. Green are obviously the best here, but I found labour to be surprisingly progressive this time around. Lib dem were fairly good, but not as good as labour.

I want to see politicians address overpopulation. At the moment they are actively encouraging it with the benefit system.

[Goosebump]

Yeah, I don't know who is best to run the country either. I think the Tories are still ultimately interested in keeping the rich rich and the poor poor. I think it's about time someone else got a shot.

I'm personally behind a lot of the policies of the Green Party, which is why is vote for them to raise their profile and those policies. Even if they don't have a chance of winning yet, and some of their policies need "refinement" shall we say, I want those matters to become part of people's considerations. I want other parties to take those issues seriously.

Animal policies are particularly important to me, and tories are the worst for this, followed by UKIP. Green are obviously the best here, but I found labour to be surprisingly progressive this time around. Lib dem were fairly good, but not as good as labour.

This is very admirable. At least in the UK there is a higher chance of getting "weak" parties recognition. In the US it's a virtual non-starter. I've worked on a couple, failed, campaigns here in the US to get the Greens to have enough representation in the state house to qualify for federal funding and debate media. We lost every time.

It's a major uphill battle. But I think it's one worth stressing. Here in the US we have the irony of an independent signing into the party system to get the megaphone then disparaging the same party without bring up any alternatives. Our system is so polarized into two camps that even a no party candidate is playing party politics.

I honestly have no solutions. I'm not sure what it would take to get minority parties larger voices other then votes. It's always strange to me that Jewish people have on of the most successful lobbies in the US and Atheists have next to zero lobby influence but make up more of the population. Politics is nuanced, and money, but more then that I think it's general trends in public opinion. And the trends, at least here in the US, aren't ready for more then 2 parties (it's like our sports, how can more then 2 compete?) And we sure as shit aren't ready for nuance.

[account_inactive]

-deleted-

I'll edit this again at some point.

[Napoléon]

Really? I mean the US was founded on that kind of crazy political unity with the states. The US is roughly something like 9.6m KM2, all of Europe with GB is not much more at 10.4m I really thought he meant it as a jest.

I guess you're just forgetting the part where the US was 'founded' directly out of secession from Britain? All in the name of what?

The US is called the "FREE WORLD". Like I said, once you open your borders with Mexico and let another country like Canada have a say in your laws, then you can patronise the UK on staying in the EU.

[Goosebump]

Really? I mean the US was founded on that kind of crazy political unity with the states. The US is roughly something like 9.6m KM2, all of Europe with GB is not much more at 10.4m I really thought he meant it as a jest.

I guess you're just forgetting the part where the US was 'founded' directly out of secession from Britain? All in the name of what?

The US is called the "FREE WORLD". Like I said, once you open your borders with Mexico and let another country like Canada have a say in your laws, then you can patronise the UK on staying in the EU.

Well we have 50 states that routinely conduct a peaceful revolt of the commander in chief of our military every 4 years. We reaffirm or repace our sub-state members every 2 years with no armed revolution or districts threatening to revolt and leave the union or their state. In those same periods depending on the state we reaffirm or instate a new Representative for our entire state.


I suppose the concept maybe alien to you. But I'm pretty sure you adopted something similar after we did, only on a much smaller scale seeing as how your nation is very small and thus far easier to govern. But I'm assured that is of no consequence since you have an opinion!

I've heard these are very important. Facts become rendered as mere wax once waylaid by the slightest flame in subtle presence of your temperament.  If you are set in your ways, then declare that you are a missionary for you cause and the cause of the Queen. Otherwise drop such pretense as an objective debtor, should you ever have trifled with the title, it is very unbecoming of any man, more so an English man.

[Goosebump]

Really? I mean the US was founded on that kind of crazy political unity with the states. The US is roughly something like 9.6m KM2, all of Europe with GB is not much more at 10.4m I really thought he meant it as a jest.

I guess you're just forgetting the part where the US was 'founded' directly out of secession from Britain? All in the name of what?

The US is called the "FREE WORLD". Like I said, once you open your borders with Mexico and let another country like Canada have a say in your laws, then you can patronise the UK on staying in the EU.

Also this is funny =). Yah having a "revolution" from the EU hahahahahah

[I_am_not_mafia]

I hope we stay in just long enough for me to freely move to Europe with the EU open-borders (and never look back)

After that, do what you want Brits.

I can definitely recommend it. You either find somewhere better to live or you appreciate what was good about the place you left. In practise it's a mixture of the two. I moved to Germany for three years and I didn't intend coming back. I moved back to Scotland a 1 1/2 year contract but I intend to move back to Germany. But I'm also now prepared to move anywhere in Europe.

The younger generation are utterly screwed in the UK. Not that I count myself as that any more at the age of 41 but I was late and missed jumping on the goodies wagon before the ladder was pulled up.

The problem is always learning the language well enough that you can get yourself some stability. I was working in an English speaking work environment which meant that I had little exposure to the language and few chances to practice. It takes a long time to properly learn a language. It also means that I had to look for work in other English speaking work environments which meant that even though there was a shortage of software engineers in Germany, I was competing with a massive amount of other software engineers who couldn't speak German.

Another problem I found that with engineering at least, Germany is quite a sexist culture compared to the UK and this also affected my ability to find work.