I hate Church and still feel obligated to go

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

dragon, if you still feel obligation to attend divine services, all I can do is suggest you make the most of it. For instance, you could go early and switch the organ sheet music with that for 'Inna Gada Da Vida'. Or you could fart and then shout, 'Hark! An angel has spoken!'. If you make it all the way through the service, stop someone outside the church and ask them their opinion of the Book of Peloponnesians. After they tell you, inform them that there IS no 'Book of Peloponnesians'.

My personal fave, though, is to bring a few small plastic dinosaurs to church. At some point during the Lesson, take them out and start playing with them. When someone asks you what you think you're doing, calmly reply, 'These are dinosaurs. They ruled the Earth for 150 million years.' Great fun.

Boru

[brewer]

It seems that you are willing, at least in part, to consent to this church activity so I'm not quite sure how much sympathy I have. If it can down to your wife choosing you and your not participating or the church activity/socializing which one do you think she would pick? Sounds like the two of you need to have a heartfelt discussion. I socialize with xtians all of the time, just not at church/church events (my wife is catholic). Is this not an option for your wife?

Never had this situation with a spouse, only parents. When they forced me to attend I'd go but walk out within 10 minutes, with the whole congregation watching. It only took them a couple of times to get the hint. It became easier for them to attend without me than have the embarrassment of everyone seeing me walk out and not return. You could try the same thing but it may bring you to much grief.

The devious part of my mind says teach scary old testament sunday school. Focus on the killing and misogyny in the bible. They'll ask you to quit. But that may be to over the top and needlessly scar the kids.

You should not have to live your life as a hypocrite. Does your wife understand that? Would she live hers that way?

Good luck!

[dragonman73]

I agree with Rob.  She's unfairly pressuring you to do something you don't want to do, mostly to keep up appearances.  It's, ironically, very unchristian-like behavior.

There's something that doesn't feel quite right about how you describe how she's trying to force the two of you as being a package deal with church activity.  Is she trying to force you to go to church because, even though she's not devout, she doesn't like that you're an atheist?  That somehow it's just a phase?  I dunno, that part just seems peculiar to me.

What's stopping her from teaching the Sunday school class(es), by the way?  Seems like the perfect solution.

I think part of it is she doesn't want to be "that wife" who is at church without her husband every Sunday.  Another part is, while she hasn't mentioned it that she thinks there is "hope" for me I supposed. I made it clear why I don't believe and why I am an atheist. I think she thinks is a phase like you said.

Typical christian fashion she thinks something bad has happened to me that drove me off the path. I think she's mentioned I didn't start believing this way until my mom died in 2010. But it was way after that. 

Truth be told it was when the pastor got on the pulpit one Sunday back in 2012 and did a sermon on tithing. He said we owe the Church 10% of our gross before taxes and God didn't care what debt you have. It lead me on a path to trying to figure things out...then it all started looking like BS to me.

She could def teach the class if she was one of those type of people. She's not very organized and doesn't like talking in front of people. Usually she sits there while I do all the talking...I don't think she wants to teach a class by herself. Another reason it is put on me.

---

There is something about religious wives and atheist husbands. For instance my cousin was always an atheist and even bragged, when we were kids, how he always spits 3 times on the church when he passes by it and yet he met some christian woman who made him baptize and marry in the fucking church and I know few more guys like that. I mean really guys you need to grow a pair.
You see they don't believe and don't really care they just go to the church maybe once every few years, but at the same time let their own kids be roasted by this religious assholes that tell them science is a lie and make them at least confused that they'll have problems learning science in school not to mention later finishing worthy college, if they don't go full fanatic. So at least you should do it for your kids and therefore for the rest of the world, because world would certainly be a better place if there were more smarter people.

Maybe you should confront your wife and discuss about the core of Christianity and the fact that it has been debunked. I'm not saying to press her into de-converting, but go trough some facts, some books (like Jerry Coyne's 'Faith Versus Fact') and/or something like Richard Dawkins videos on youtube. For instance how science shows us that Adam and Eve never existed and therefore Jesus' mission is bullshit. If she refuses to even talk about it ask her if she wants to be a stubborn fanatic that she doesn't want to learn some scientific facts and if they don't convince her then you'll all revert back to religion. I mean you said that she was already on the "other" side but she obviously needs to go deeper.
When it comes to your community, of course you need to go step by step, but if you have your wife on your side and they don't accept you as you are then fuck them. Are people that don't accept you really worthy of your company? Maybe they drag you in in some ideological conversations but you explain them.

Honestly, when wife and I first for married we lived in another town away from her friends and family and joined the church there. We were "members" for a few years but rarely went. I don't think my wife cares about going either. Or at least that has been proven in the past.

Tried discussing things with her already. Even had her sit through a couple of Richard dawkin videos and several of the youtube channels on Christianity. She shuts down and when I try to talk about it with her she says I am making fun of her beliefs.....even when I sugar coat it and try and approach it on tactfully.

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It seems that you are willing, at least in part, to consent to this church activity so I'm not quite sure how much sympathy I have. If it can down to your wife choosing you and your not participating or the church activity/socializing which one do you think she would pick? Sounds like the two of you need to have a heartfelt discussion. I socialize with xtians all of the time, just not at church/church events (my wife is catholic). Is this not an option for your wife?

Never had this situation with a spouse, only parents. When they forced me to attend I'd go but walk out within 10 minutes, with the whole congregation watching. It only took them a couple of times to get the hint. It became easier for them to attend without me than have the embarrassment of everyone seeing me walk out and not return. You could try the same thing but it may bring you to much grief.

The devious part of my mind says teach scary old testament sunday school. Focus on the killing and misogyny in the bible. They'll ask you to quit. But that may be to over the top and needlessly scar the kids.

You should not have to live your life as a hypocrite. Does your wife understand that? Would she live hers that way?

Good luck!

It's a fine line, especially when your married. You want to compromise and make everyone happy. I'm trying to keep my wife in good graces with her parents, because I know if I quit going they will start acting like I am the black sheep. Even though I am educated, work hard, pay my bills and am not a burden to anyone. 

Also add to the fact that we are so involved right now with kids stuff that it's hard to rip that band aid off without being noticeable. I wanted to start scaling back, getting other people to take our spots every other sunday and so forth. That way I can just fade out and nobody notices because someone else is picking up the slack.

We've had heartfelt discussions, then they turn into an argument. But I told her yesterday I am just going to quit going. She got up today, waited until the last minute to leave and then she went to church. She came home and she's fine.

I think she's embarrassed to be there without her husband because then people start talking or want to know where I am at. And like most Christians she provably used the "he sick" excuse.

[robvalue]

Good for you, for making a clear decision about it. I honestly think it's the right one.

I agree that there is compromise in any relationship, especially marriage. But there's a point at which compromise becomes "compromising yourself". That's when things have gone too far. In my opinion, no relationship is worth that.

I'm glad it worked out reasonably well. I hope your wife continues to respect your position. If she starts trying to emotionally blackmail you, it's her that is creating the problem and personally I wouldn't stand for anything like that.

I'm sad she thinks it's "just a phase", it's rather patronising. But I don't want to assume too much about you and your wife, so I won't say any more!

[dragonman73]

Good for you, for making a clear decision about it. I honestly think it's the right one.

I agree that there is compromise in any relationship, especially marriage. But there's a point at which compromise becomes "compromising yourself". That's when things have gone too far. In my opinion, no relationship is worth that.

I'm glad it worked out reasonably well. I hope your wife continues to respect your position. If she starts trying to emotionally blackmail you, it's her that is creating the problem and personally I wouldn't stand for anything like that.

I'm sad she thinks it's "just a phase", it's rather patronising. But I don't want to assume too much about you and your wife, so I won't say any more!

It's ok, I get it. I know everybody's situation is different and I def don't want anyone making assumptions. But yeah while she had mentioned it lately, she's still hung up on "my salvation" and I guess any attempt to be at church gives her hope.

I've asked her why she believes several times and she's never given me a straight answer. She just believes because she does...that's about it.

But I have been very clear why I don't believe, and I think they are legitimate answers. Most of it falls back on no evidence of miracles or events that actually happened...and the fact that science has disproved most of Biblical claims and what it can't disprove isn't even testable because it doesn't exist.

Plus the fact the Bible is downright silly in most of it's scriptures, contradicts itself, and full of hate, rape, and killings. Not the sugar coated stuff thats always talked about in  Church.

And with all of the hypocrisy and hate towards the LGBT community lately, that's not something I want to be associated with. I'm actually more tolerant towards other groups since I stopped believing in the Bible.

But I guarantee you that catfish / seafood restaurants  and Christians go hand in hand in my area. They love their shellfish, especially after Church on Sundays.

Wife has opened up a little, but for the most part she still shuts down when I start asking her to reason why she believes what she does and is there any fact to the claims.  

Her whole identity and friends are tied with Church, and I get it. She doesn't want to lose that, even though she's not a practicing Christian. Heck she cusses like a sailor sometimes lol.

[robvalue]

I understand that. When someone is so heavily invested, it can be a lot to lose. Sadly, losing friends over it may be a reality also. Some people only like others because they share beliefs. Not friends I would value, but there you go.

As you touched on, whether Christianity is "true" or not isn't the issue. The issue is whether you want anything to do with the religion at all. Personally, I don't give a rat's ass how much of it is true. The whole thing is rotten through with immorality from start to finish, and any good that comes out of it is incidental and could have been accomplished better and with less bullshit in other ways.

So to me, it's more a case of "Why do you worship this disgusting evil God?" rather than "Why do you believe this God is real?"

[brewer]

Her whole identity and friends are tied with Church, and I get it. She doesn't want to lose that, even though she's not a practicing Christian. Heck she cusses like a sailor sometimes lol.

So do thing with her friends, just not church things. Show up at the after church lunch. Plan some nights out with the friends that does not include religion. I have a hard time believing that religion is that integral to her friendships. But I could be wrong. Do they talk religion all of the time?

After thought. Do you think your wife fears death with no afterlife? You mentioned salvation.

[vorlon13]

As a general principle (not specific to relgiousity or atheism) terms and conditions freely entered into in contemplation of marriage are to be respected.

Having said that, I've noted the surplus of (pardon the term) middle aged marriage eligible women vs the number of middle aged marriage eligible men.  If she's willing to divorce over this, you, as the man are statistically more likely to find a (pardon the term) a better deal, than she is.


A dear friend of my older sis extracted a 'and hope to die' promise prior to her wedding from her groom to stop smoking as soon as all the hubbub of the wedding was over.

30 years later, he is still smoking and  on full disability (smoking related), and she is stuck being his goddam nurse.  She knew if she tried to hold  him to his smoking pledge, he'd leave for another woman who either smoked herself or didn't care. And there they are.  My sis just found out he's on disability, and apparently he's been on it a couple years.  Just indicates to me she is aware this is a sore subject and it doesn't reflect well on either of them.


DISCLAIMER:

I'm gay, take advice on hetero marriage from me at your own peril  

[Fake Messiah]

Also you can take a look at this short documentary about ex preacher, Jerry DeWitt, who is an atheist in the bible belt and also organizes atheist gatherings in the bible belt, so since you also live in BB maybe you can get in touch with him
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54tHbaHci3A

And also
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjEY-6Ti5I4

[Minimalist]

It lead me on a path to trying to figure things out...then it all started looking like BS to me.

Yep.  Religion is the most lucrative scam in history.  It actually beats theft in that you don't have to do any work at all and morons just give you money.