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Present a BETTER worldview
#91
RE: Present a BETTER worldview
Answered what exactly? The answer Ive gotten is "We dont know and how dare you say you do"
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#92
RE: Present a BETTER worldview
(October 3, 2010 at 5:08 am)blood_pardon Wrote: I dont think he has a proper understanding of the evidence surrounding the BB and how it actually shows God created the universe ex nihilio, but I agree with his main point and it is mine. You do not have a BETTER explanation.
Here's a thought experiment: You walk by a construction yard and observe a cat and a small rat both wander into a section of plastic piping at opposite ends, the cat emerges out the other side, but the rat does not.

Trying to figure out what happened to the rat you visit the construction yard the next day but the plastic poly-pipes are all gone with no remains of the rat. No one else witnessed what happened but you.

What happened to the rat? You hazard many educated/uneducated/imaginative guesses - the rat scared the cat... the cat ignored the rat but the rat was too scared to move... the cat and rat passed by each other in separate pipes within the poly-pipe... the rat was an alien that teleported back to its mother ship... the rat died of natural causes... the rat escaped through an unseen hole in the piping... and so on.

All of these possibilities seem absurd to you because none have evidence, so desperate are you for an answer you latch onto the most appealing scenario you can think of: that the rat was killed and eaten by the cat because the rat did not emerge out the other side but the cat did.

Irrespective of that, you can't present a valid justifiable answer; the only honest answer here is "I don't know", regardless of how frustrating it is not knowing the true order of events or having a 'better' explanation.

At least we know there was a big bang event billions of years ago because there's radio-wave evidence of this to support the theory, but to speculate what happened before that, what occurred before time and space is futile because our understanding of the laws of physics start to breakdown and we've no experimental evidence to work with. We don't know. Arguing any further at this point is either for the logically unknowable or impossible. That doesn't necessarily mean scientists won't figure out what prompted the bang, but the current unexplained is just that, the unexplained.
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#93
RE: Present a BETTER worldview
(October 3, 2010 at 5:08 am)blood_pardon Wrote: I dont think he has a proper understanding of the evidence surrounding the BB and how it actually shows God created the universe ex nihilio, but I agree with his main point and it is mine. You do not have a BETTER explanation.

Actually - we do. We have one backed by science and all of the empirical evidence that has allowed us to reach those conclusions and theories.
"Lack of a better explaination" - if it ever was an actual arguement for something - doesnt mean a made up answer is just as acceptable as a scientific one. God's place in the creation of the universe is unnecessary and extraneous.
If it weren't for the fact that religion has survived into the 21st century there would be no theories that lead to any religous conclusion and the only reason it exists now is because there are many people who want that to be the case, but the fact of the matter is that it isn't because the desire for something to be true is not even close to being the same as something actually being true or even the possibility of being true.
If today you can take a thing like evolution and make it a crime to teach in the public schools, tomorrow you can make it a crime to teach it in the private schools and next year you can make it a crime to teach it to the hustings or in the church. At the next session you may ban books and the newspapers...
Ignorance and fanaticism are ever busy and need feeding. Always feeding and gloating for more. Today it is the public school teachers; tomorrow the private. The next day the preachers and the lecturers, the magazines, the books, the newspapers. After a while, Your Honor, it is the setting of man against man and creed against creed until with flying banners and beating drums we are marching backward to the glorious ages of the sixteenth centry when bigots lighted fagots to burn the men who dared to bring any intelligence and enlightenment and culture to the human mind. ~Clarence Darrow, at the Scopes Monkey Trial, 1925

Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan
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#94
RE: Present a BETTER worldview
Welsh Cake Wrote:Here's a thought experiment: You walk by a construction yard and observe a cat and a small rat both wander into a section of plastic piping at opposite ends, the cat emerges out the other side, but the rat does not.

Trying to figure out what happened to the rat you visit the construction yard the next day but the plastic poly-pipes are all gone with no remains of the rat. No one else witnessed what happened but you.

What happened to the rat? You hazard many educated/uneducated/imaginative guesses - the rat scared the cat... the cat ignored the rat but the rat was too scared to move... the cat and rat passed by each other in separate pipes within the poly-pipe... the rat was an alien that teleported back to its mother ship... the rat died of natural causes... the rat escaped through an unseen hole in the piping... and so on.

All of these possibilities seem absurd to you because none have evidence, so desperate are you for an answer you latch onto the most appealing scenario you can think of: that the rat was killed and eaten by the cat because the rat did not emerge out the other side but the cat did.

Irrespective of that, you can't present a valid justifiable answer; the only honest answer here is "I don't know", regardless of how frustrating it is not knowing the true order of events or having a 'better' explanation.

At least we know there was a big bang event billions of years ago because there's radio-wave evidence of this to support the theory, but to speculate what happened before that, what occurred before time and space is futile because our understanding of the laws of physics start to breakdown and we've no experimental evidence to work with. We don't know. Arguing any further at this point is either for the logically unknowable or impossible.

This is a cool post kudos to you brah.
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#95
RE: Present a BETTER worldview
(October 3, 2010 at 5:08 am)blood_pardon Wrote: B) Intelligent design- A God created all things in the universe, including man, and endowed us with reason, knowledge and all of the qualities that define him.

I find this quite funny, since it's usually those who are against ID that say it's the work of God. According to the idea of Intelligent Design, an "intelligent agent" was at work that made everything, though we can't identify that "intelligent agent"

Plus, ID wouldn't ever be considered a real scientific theory because of the inability to observe, hypothesize, test, and then explain with correct evidence. How can you "observe" an unidentifiable "agent?"
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